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| OOC: Imperator Scottorum; Great Irish Civil War | |
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| Topic Started: Apr 4 2010, 04:57 PM (7,373 Views) | |
| Hastine | Jun 6 2010, 05:11 PM Post #326 |
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Universi enim hic sumus.
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Two points: I'm assuming that because you have so many numbers for just one of your fleets (I checked the stronger nation on NS that you changed to, it's about the same size as mine), that you're sacrificing quality over quantity, while I've done the opposite with 3X the quality, but less numbers. Keep that in mind. And I know that you have more of naval presence in the region than I have, but you also have England to deal with (who's lightly guarding my flank), and if I see signs that you're breaking through to rear me, I'll rear you with my Jolorian Fleet (the same size as the Helusian Fleet), which is already doing manoevers in the Bay of Biscay. Even if the Isle of Wight falls, I'll make sure that I'm leaving the English Channel with numbers to spare, you can be sure of that. |
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| Deleted User | Jun 6 2010, 05:32 PM Post #327 |
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Deleted User
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Don't count out the Pirates, plus I have several fleets down there, so my naval presence is huge. It would be a 4:1 ratio in your case. Both of your fleets are damaged, one is getting repaired, and the other isn't. My fleet can rely on a steady stream of repairs/fresh ships, given my proximity. And you have the British also to look out for. And besides, x3 quality really wont help you. I can shoot 4 missiles, you shoot 1. It only takes 1 missile to sink your vessel. You can easily be overwhelmed in this case. Venice included too, once you add in the Pirate and British factors. |
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| Hastine | Jun 6 2010, 05:52 PM Post #328 |
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Universi enim hic sumus.
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If quality didn't count in this game, then the people who originally made the army rules wouldn't have put it there. You have to abide by it. Plus, 3x quality would mean a ship would have stronger, higher-quality armor, making the "one missile and you're dead" argument null. And the Jolorian Fleet is largely repaired, while the Helusian Fleet is battered up a bit but still fight-worthy (remember, I retreated not long after I engaged your navy in the Irish Sea). The Jolorian Fleet has been in the docks for a while now, so I assume that it's battle-ready. Your naval numbers are, however, overwhelming, I'll admit. Let's agree on the outcome via PM. Edited by Hastine, Jun 6 2010, 05:52 PM.
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| Menhad | Jun 6 2010, 06:20 PM Post #329 |
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ET2(IDW)
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Now I'm not a mod, so what I say can easily be overwritten by some one who is. The quality rule, as I understand it, is for training. Soldiers that are 2x have two times the training of standard soldiers. After all, an M16 shoots that same round(Thus the same killing power), even if its used by a special forces member. But he would be more accurate and quicker than a grunt. Now for overall quality, its a mix of numbers(Having less, or more) and budget. It doesn't matter how few ships you have if your budget is pathetic, any extra funds would barely go anywhere. Ships are expensive and any 'upgrades' are as well. Now how this relates to ships is kinda awkward, and I'm not sure how to go about it. You do have 3 times less the amount of ships a standard navy has, so this means you would have more money to upgrade your other ships. But how much can you really upgrade a ships? Infantry is easy to equip them better, there is a lot of stuff that is non-standard that is useful in combat. Shot direction detectors, night vision, special ammo, special grenades, sights, body, etc. But a ship? Well, better missiles maybe? But now days the differences would be small. Most ship-to-ship weapons are powerful as is, you could only improve a little bit Thicker armor? Yeah, but all missiles are designed to do more than they need too. It wouldn't help much. Better training? Well these days with automation, training doesn't mean much, but it would help alot with fire control, repairs. Newer technology? Better sonar and radar would be helpful, but the standard stuff is damn good too. ___ The point is that ships represent the state of the art, and little can be done to improve their performance (Not by 3x at least). Some yes, but not that much. If you notice, the TO has one of the worlds (Single) highest military budgets, and I don't do 2x or 3x or anything like that on my ships, just my soldiers. As I said to Tou, a ship is hard to sink, and still most ships batter each other into submission. During the Falkland War two British helicopters launched four anti-ship missile at a patrol gunboat, that did not sink it. As a veteran I am fine with you, Vesp, to just multiply your numbers by 3 and go on that, But I am no mod. Edited by Menhad, Jun 6 2010, 06:25 PM.
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| Deleted User | Jun 6 2010, 08:21 PM Post #330 |
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Deleted User
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:P I think it would be beneficial if we all sat down and learned a lot about contemporary naval warfare. |
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| Porcu | Jun 6 2010, 08:27 PM Post #331 |
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"Work is the curse of the drinking classes."
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I apologize to everyone, but with my study schedule and the little effort I've put into my RP with Telo I'm afraid I won't be able to make any quality posts here. That said, I would like my presence to still be felt as the Luftwaffe is one of the strongest airforces in the region at the moment (I'm not entirely sure but Tou's airforce might also be out in force). Porcu currently has a ceasefire/non-aggression pact with the T.O., but I'm assuming (because no one else has talked to me about a ceasefire) that Otto's other allies are good targets. Basically, I'm hoping that you all will still make references to my airforce and it's very real ability to inflict damage. I'm perfectly fine with taking some damage, but nearly the entirety of the Luftwaffe is currently operating in and around the Isles. I hope this request is appropriate. Thank you. |
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| Deleted User | Jun 6 2010, 08:36 PM Post #332 |
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Deleted User
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Will your air force prevent us from making any serious gains in the Irish mainland? Will it be a vastly important factor in deciding the outcome of the war? |
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| Porcu | Jun 6 2010, 08:44 PM Post #333 |
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"Work is the curse of the drinking classes."
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I would imagine it would be a fairly large factor. My airforce certainly cannot stop you from making gains, but I would imagine that gains could be slow as I could target supply routes, armor and infantry, naval units, etc. I'm hoping that the war will establish the Luftwaffe as a premier airforce, but as long as my forces are not wiped out or beaten to a pulp I'll be fine with most anything you guys write up. |
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| Deleted User | Jun 6 2010, 08:49 PM Post #334 |
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Deleted User
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:lol: Well I'll stay away, seeing how I got my ass kicked by you. |
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| Deleted User | Jun 8 2010, 11:30 PM Post #335 |
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Deleted User
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Well is anyone going to do anything? |
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| Hastine | Jun 9 2010, 12:52 AM Post #336 |
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Universi enim hic sumus.
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I'm pretty much on lock-down for the next week and a half due to homework. I might be able to fit a quick post in on Thursday, but we'll see. |
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| Union | Jun 9 2010, 10:59 AM Post #337 |
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Pyrenees Republic
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If Porcu gets involved with their air force in an exceptionally heavy way, the Union will counter with their own. We've only been staying out as is because the balance of power is equal, but if the odds for the Genesians dwindle to zero, or if the home territory of any "Genesian" power is violated (havn't really kept up with it), we will join as full partners. I know, ICly, the Union is pretty quiet, but do remember that in terms of the powers currently involved, I would be fifth (behind Tou by a couple billion, and Menhad/Porcu by one billion, but effectively equal to Pyria, and effectively twice as large as Venice, Ireland or Att), helping put this war back in a position where the outcome is not without doubt. I'm much closer, logistically, than either Porcu, Venice or TO as well. Do you have specific numbers for your air force, Porcu? Edited by Union, Jun 9 2010, 11:16 AM.
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| Aelius | Jun 9 2010, 11:28 AM Post #338 |
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Norman Warlord
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I've got my men in Wales, but they attacked my territory first. |
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| Union | Jun 9 2010, 11:31 AM Post #339 |
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Pyrenees Republic
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I know, but you're a non threat. We can get you out of there, as long as the big players don't join in. :P |
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| Porcu | Jun 9 2010, 01:38 PM Post #340 |
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"Work is the curse of the drinking classes."
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Damnit. It would really help to know if I'll have decent, regular internet access while I'm away, but I don't so... No, H, I don't have any specific numbers for you. IC-wise I wouldn't want to stir any serious trouble against you and would certainly not welcome this move, as it puts us squarely in opposite camps. I have given broad permission to everyone to make small, occasional remarks about the Luftwaffe, but I'm not entirely sure what to do now. Since Porcu already managed to negotiate a non-aggression pact with the Teutons, would it be out of the question for a similar agreement to be made between us? It's not like I don't want to keep my forces in, it's just I'm not sure what the hell I can actually do. |
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| Union | Jun 9 2010, 01:48 PM Post #341 |
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Pyrenees Republic
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Well, one my closest allies is (whatever Atticus is called), and I am a Genesian state by law, so increasing your participation in any real way against both these elements would be difficult without justifying my non-response. Ultimately what I am interested in is an end to war. I am hoping to force the issue by challenging Venice. We would be content splitting Ireland as it is, and apathetic towards a victory by William, but our priority, like Tou (I think) is ending the war and thus reducing the negative effect it has on trade. If Porcu were to switch its priority towards peace, and less defense of William, we could sidestep the issue entirely. |
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| Telosan | Jun 9 2010, 01:48 PM Post #342 |
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The Foremost Intellectual Badass
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Huesca, how is the Union closer than Venice? Our lands are on the same parallel of Iberia. EDIT: I thought our treaty only applied to expansions and such? How could I feasibly have a military alliance with two British Isle countries without being able to assist either as need be? Edited by Telosan, Jun 9 2010, 01:52 PM.
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| Union | Jun 9 2010, 01:52 PM Post #343 |
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Pyrenees Republic
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I was assuming that the bulk of Iberian forces and military supplies are used in the performance of general occupation duties. If they're off gallivanting around Europe, then all the more pressing the concern because of the speed with which I can strike at those lightly defended territories if you do not comply. Unless your ships and men in Venice teleport to Ferrol before embarking? :P
Edited by Union, Jun 9 2010, 01:55 PM.
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| Telosan | Jun 9 2010, 01:54 PM Post #344 |
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The Foremost Intellectual Badass
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I have my entire navy in the British Isles, with the exception of the Adriatic Fleet, which never leaves the home territory. The Adriatic Fleet is also the smallest. Oh, and your treaty essentially says you can attack Galicia without being in violation, but I can't defend Galicia without breaking the terms of the agreement? |
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| Union | Jun 9 2010, 01:56 PM Post #345 |
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Pyrenees Republic
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No. It states you cannot engage in belligerent action (belligerent meaning the conduct of war) outside of the territories already under your control west of that line, and I cannot engage in similar activities to the east. This rules out expansion, but not defense. On the other issue: My navy is twice the size of yours, and undivided. My air force is twice the size of yours, and also undivided. My ground forces are twice the size of yours, and only lightly committed in Pau. :P Please do not think I am trying to pick on you, by the way. I have more free time nowadays, and had intended to be involved in this from the start, just wasn't able too. Edited by Union, Jun 9 2010, 02:00 PM.
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| Porcu | Jun 9 2010, 01:59 PM Post #346 |
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"Work is the curse of the drinking classes."
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*Sigh* I think I may have to, considering my schedule. Thinking about it now, it may not be fair to those still on William's if I cannot use my airforce to its fullest to support them. Question is, how can I possibly start a draw back and work towards peace? I've just basically eliminated Att's airforce and settled myself down for the first time in the war. Would some public declaration stating Porcu's intentions for peace coupled with a call for cooperation between our countries make this any easier? |
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| Union | Jun 9 2010, 02:01 PM Post #347 |
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Pyrenees Republic
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Certainly. Such a move would be positively received by our government as justification for its ultimatum and international support behind it, and less as unwarranted interference. Indeed, we'd be willing to be formal partners with Porcu and Tou, and only talk of support for TO and Atticus in some sort of broad peace-keeping measure in which three big powers essentially force an end to war.
Edited by Union, Jun 9 2010, 02:02 PM.
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| Telosan | Jun 9 2010, 02:01 PM Post #348 |
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The Foremost Intellectual Badass
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Hmm, so not only is Venice screwed in the isles, they're also screwed on the home front? I need to start answering issues on my NS account... Eh, I'll keep at it. Galicia taking serious damage would provide further cause for a civil war resulting in the loss of those territories. Plus I've run up against the treaty a few times now, so I might as well just ignore it at this point. EDIT: Venice won't fault Porcu from dropping out of the war, regardless of their reasons, though the Venetian public might think you're running in the face of impossible odds. Edited by Telosan, Jun 9 2010, 02:03 PM.
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| Union | Jun 9 2010, 02:03 PM Post #349 |
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Pyrenees Republic
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The Union does hold as a semi-secret goal the reinstatement of a unified Falangist regime for all of Spain. If we were to achieve military dominance in Galicia and Valicia we would annex them, or at least, incorporate them in some way under a broad confederacy/alliance of Spain structure. In addition, the Union would take a much more aggressive position against Venice in all its future endeavors if you simply broke the treaty, and make very public statements about your general deciet, treachery, and untrustworthiness to other nations hoping to hurt relations. We would also withdraw recognition of your occupation of Southern France, and support action to relieve you of that land. Edited by Union, Dec 10 2010, 12:15 AM.
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| Telosan | Jun 9 2010, 02:14 PM Post #350 |
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The Foremost Intellectual Badass
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Get in line; the TO already does that. :P Once a territory is already under my control, can it become unrecognized again if people withdraw their recognitions? Taking southern France would be a threat to several other countries as well, so Venice might not be the only one involved in it's defense. |
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11:34 AM Jul 13