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NS2 and The H
Topic Started: Sep 26 2009, 12:22 PM (2,132 Views)
Union
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Pyrenees Republic
My infatuation with this map is well known by this point:

http://img36.imageshack.us/i/hereo.png/

Players can pick a maximum of 15 provinces in Europe with a maximum of 30 in the Balkans.

15 is enough for just about every country, while allowing for creativity for people who wish to develop their own.
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Telosan
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The Foremost Intellectual Badass
Blue lines are provinces? It's not numbered, no claims are a bit harder. I like the other map you had much better.
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Union
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Pyrenees Republic
Blue lines are one territory. I can make the map much more usable for you, in two seconds. :)
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Toussaint
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Major
I think 15 territories is too much...
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Union
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Pyrenees Republic
This is an alternative system: You can have up to 15 points worth of provinces. Default is 1 point a province, but some provinces, particularly the ones that control key straits, or that are larger than usual, are worth more than 1 points.

The point value is seen on the map below as X-A where A is the points a province costs.

I made the provinces in the Balkans larger, to make keep it consistent.

http://img19.imageshack.us/img19/7312/prototypec.png

Map is a work in progress, obviously. Simply testing public opinion. :)

There will be a version in the map without numbers, to make map edits easy.
Edited by Union, Oct 4 2009, 10:23 PM.
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lebowski2123
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Resident?
Posted Image

IS this readable or too crude?
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Union
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Pyrenees Republic
That's not Translyvania, y'know.

Try it on the map I posted above. It should be easier. Just use the paintbucket tool.
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Union
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Pyrenees Republic
http://img29.imageshack.us/i/mapwithprovinces.png/

To pick a spot say:

"COLOR ##-#"

So, picking Andalusia would be:

"YELLOW 1-4"

Each player picks up to 15 points - the second number in each plot is the amount of points that province "costs".

Mapmakers use this: http://img195.imageshack.us/img195/9329/mapforeditors.png

This map was designed to be easily editable in MSPaint, with the paintbucket tool.

Leb- Translyvania on the map I posted here is BLUE 28-1, 36-1
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lebowski2123
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Resident?
I know, it's Transdanubia.
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Sedulius
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Telosan
Oct 4 2009, 06:03 PM
As far as I know, this has been approved by a good portion of people. Anyone who opposes hasn't said anything.

Huesca's proposal said we'd start with the European map and as time went on, we'd open other areas of the world after a set time.

IRL, the Byzantines were on good/alright/neutral terms with the Venetians. The land near Jerusalem was allowed to be handed over as reward for Venice's role in rescuing Constantinople from the Turks. The land in Egypt was the result of a buisness transaction, though Venice did overstep the line set in the deal. The rest of Venice is outside of Byzantine lands, unless of course you're counting the Western Roman Empire as well.

EDIT: There's also a limit on the number of territories you can pick, and you can't get the whole empire in 15 territories. In fact, I think the empire fell by the time we're starting, though I'm not sure. You could explain the small size of the empire by claiming the Arabs took it.

EDIT 2: BTW, when are we going to get this started?
First of all, the time we've picked isn't clear yet. If it is any time before 1454 then the Empire could still exist (Constantinople fell to the Turks in 1453).

The Byzantines and Venetians were never on good terms. They hated each other. It was the Venetian doge who caused the taking of Constantinople by the 4th "Crusade" in 1204.

Seeing as your Venice holds Crete and Cyprus, former Byzantine possessions, those would be some of the first targets of my empire after fighting off the Turks.

Anyways, if we're claiming territories, then I'll take 9T, 10T, 12T, 14T, 15T, 28T, 1T, 2T, 3T, and 4T.
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Telosan
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Quote:
 
The Byzantines and Venetians were never on good terms. They hated each other. It was the Venetian doge who caused the taking of Constantinople by the 4th "Crusade" in 1204.
:whistling:

Venice and Constantinople repeatedly worked together in many wars. Towards the end of the empire, the Byzantines had next to no navy, relying heavily on Venetians.

Quote:
 
Seeing as your Venice holds Crete and Cyprus, former Byzantine possessions, those would be some of the first targets of my empire after fighting off the Turks.
It seems the Turks may already have allies...

This map is much more readable, thanks. I do have one request, though. Can there be a larger version of the map? When I try to zoom in it's too blurry to read. I still prefer the original is only the regions were smaller. Dunno, something about the first one seems awesome.

Claims: 15 points.

LIGHT BLUE - 17 and 9.
BLUE - 9, 10, 11, 19, 20, 21, 22, and 23
TAN - 14 and 19
WHATEVER COLOR MOST OF AFRICA IS - 23 and 24.
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lebowski2123
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Resident?
I'd say the US and USSR worked together throughout World War 2, with the Soviets relying on US aid to rebound, but that doesn't mean they were ever on good terms.
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Union
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Pyrenees Republic
Telo, making it larger would make it harder to use in MSPaint. The only place the numbers get fucked up in any significant way is north-west blue. Everywhere else they are perfectly clear. :)

Sed - the time is 1452, and fake history begins at 1350.

We should hold off on claiming territories until an actual map thread is made. :rolleyes:
Edited by Union, Oct 5 2009, 05:32 PM.
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Telosan
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The Foremost Intellectual Badass
Quote:
 
We should hold off on claiming territories until an actual map thread is made.
I'm placing reservations.
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Tristan da Cunha
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Science and Industry
I can assist in developing NPC's.
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Telosan
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Tristan da Cunha
Oct 5 2009, 05:49 PM
I can assist in developing NPC's.
Oh, right. I wanted to volunteer for that, too. Are the NPCs going to resemble RL nations of the time as closely as possible? I'd love to see a handful of Italian and German city-states.
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Tristan da Cunha
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Science and Industry
There should be hundreds of Italian and German statelings, not merely a handful. :D
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Rhadamanthus
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Legitimist

Developing NPC's sounds like fun. I am going to tentatively stick with the Crown of Aragon at its height, since that seems like it could make for a beautiful RP. (I want all the territories the Crown ever held as an independent entity) But, I may still decide to join the NPC team.
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Union
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Pyrenees Republic
My initial proposal was for NPCs to exist in Africa, Asia, and the New World when these opened up, with Europe full of regular people, to make colonization more than just I choose X and Y and Z now give them too me.
Edited by Union, Oct 5 2009, 05:58 PM.
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Telosan
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The Foremost Intellectual Badass
There aren't going to be enough people to fill Europe unless we divide it up into much larger portions. I won't be claiming any extra land if we do that.

The NPC nations (and to an extent, PC nations) are conquerable. If we have people taking on the roles of NPCs, like Spain, Aztecs, Egyptians, and Chinese, then people will be able to step out of their nation's role if they get bored. If we cut up Italy and Germany into NPC city-states acting like the actual nations of the time, we'll have an interesting world. Maybe a PC nation allies with an NPC nation against another NPC nation that IRL hated/hate each other. NPC allies altogether sound awesome.
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Union
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Pyrenees Republic
A few white spaces is fine by me. I see no need to fill in every corner of the map, and at the same time, destroy any potential for new players to join in the game. White provinces can be described as duchies or other small fiefdoms, and if a certain region is invaded, moderators can put up a formal resistance, while having them remain white.

Larger plots erode the ability of nations to define themselves how they wish. My nation is defined by being south of the Dnepier river, but in the other map, which is harder to edit, btw, there are no provinces that accurately fit that, while in the new map there are. These provinces, furthermore, are based on RL provinces (often just combining current provinces into larger ones), which will make it easier to determine locations of major cities.

What is boring is a map of three active players, and sixteen NPCs.

I say Europe should be free of NPCs, and players which cannot or do not want to participate in colonialism (such as myself) can play with a constant nation in Europe, while playing as NPCs in Asia, Africa, or the New World.

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Tristan da Cunha
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Science and Industry
I will work with NPC's that are associated with leftover and unclaimed areas of Germany.
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Telosan
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The Foremost Intellectual Badass
I'll do the same as TC with Italy, though I wouldn't be able to do Genoa. Venice and Genoa are rivals.

If we have NPC nations in Europe, new members could just grab one and go, though it would reduce the number original nations.
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Union
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Pyrenees Republic
Why should new members be restricted from forming their own nations? Feasibly, someone could make a nation using almost all Italian provinces, even if they were not united in the real world. We are not mirroring the real world directly - there is a one hundred year grace period, and taking away the freedom of new players simply because they were not around at start is wrong.

If a new player wants to play Genoa + Florence + Rome united, who are we to say "no, pick either of the three NPC nation". If a new players wants a Swiss-Genoan union, how can we stop them if they make the history work? Turks in Athens? By all means. Make the 100 year history.

Telo, I get the impression you are searching for a clone of Total War. I never intended that when I proposed any of this, and if that is the result, I do not want to participate. Far be it from me from stopping the forum as a whole moving in this direction, if it so chooses, but it does not appeal to me. :)
Edited by Union, Oct 5 2009, 06:28 PM.
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Telosan
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The Foremost Intellectual Badass
I didn't say I was for NPC nations being dominant. I already agreed with what you've said.

I'm not looking for a clone of Total War. I got a couple of ideas from there and Age of Empires because they're great ideas. I wouldn't be involved if it resembled Total War too much because I'd just play the actual game instead.
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