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| Hypnotism; Real or Balony? | |
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| Topic Started: Dec 29 2008, 07:30 PM (67 Views) | |
| Nag Ehgoeg | Dec 29 2008, 07:30 PM Post #1 |
The Devil's Advocate
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So... hypnotism... I've had a love/hate relationship with hypnotism for a long time. I first started studying psychology and the basics of hypnotism when I was 12. I was in counseling for something I don't want to talk about, and that's when the human mind started to intrigue me. At A-level, I took psychology and aced the hypnotism module. And as I come to the close of my degree, we've studied certain aspects of psychology - including hypnotism as an alternative treatment. I've always said that hypnotism doesn't work. And years of study (both in my own time and academic) hasn't really changed my mind. Or maybe it has. Hypnotism is a form of mental conditioning. So is dianetics, taking a placebo, meditation and all forms of counseling. And, in my experience, all of these things work equally well - under the right conditions. I've been put into trance once by a trained professional (specialising in sports training). It was absolutely no different than any meditative experience I've had. I certainly don't think that hypnotism could make me run faster or otherwise improve my lot any more than taking a placebo could. However, a few days ago I was in an internet chatroom and the topic of hypnotism came up... and since then my fascination has been rekindled. While I still don't believe that anyone can be "hypnotised" into acting like a chicken, I do believe that a person's behaviour can be altered by hypnosis (just like I believe behaviour can be changed with behavioural therapy). To be hypnotised, you must want to be hypnotised and want to receive the effects. As such, I've been looking into hypnosis a lot on the internet. And I mean a lot. I've even started recording a hypnotic album. (Ten tracks: one to enter trance, eight "effects" to choose from and one waking track - so far I've only recorded three tracks.) I've also downloaded some interesting subliminal brain-washing videos. My favourite track that I've been using as a subliminal enhancer has been attached to this post. Anyone else into hypnotism? Think it's interesting? Ever studied it? |
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| Paradise | Dec 29 2008, 09:05 PM Post #2 |
Resident bureaucrat
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Unfortunately, no. I have never really been fond of psychology. |
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| flumes | Dec 29 2008, 10:28 PM Post #3 |
CLEVELAND ROCKS!
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I've always had a love/hate for psychology. The hate comes from the whole garbage of psychiatrist and psychologists..... What a bunch of crap. I've always told my parents if they ever sent me to one I'd kill them. After years of my ridiculing them they discussed sending me after my brain surgery.... Thought I might have been stressed out from it or something. Hah. I talked them out of that fast... Heck, if they had made me go, I probably would've tried to mess with them somehow (and I'm always the good kid!). Sure their are probably some people that need, and find help through them. It just wouldn't help me... I can find ways to deal/learn with things myself and don't need someone with no common sense and just some books smarts (my general perception of the two professions) telling me some garbage. My broad generalizations probably lead back to my blonde ex who hoped to be one of the two... :lol: Although my hate for them came long before her. At the same time, I think psychology in itself is a truly undervalued science. I always think that psychologists/chiatrists who truly understand how people think can do much more then sit in a room and hear people's problems...... Think of a psychologist who becomes a sports coach, or better yet a general, who understands how to motivate the mind.... Being able to instill courage simply through the understanding of the mind is a power that really is simply amazing. Just one example, but you get the idea... When considering this science anyone who has a understanding for it and moves past traditional proffesions for it has a unbelievably great potential. Sorry for that ramble. Hypnotism... I don't know? I've never seen it performed.... But I guess theoretically speaking it's possible. Still I'm skeptical. |
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| Ulgania | Dec 29 2008, 11:10 PM Post #4 |
A better Zarathustra has never rode a horse
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I've always felt that I could never be hypnotized. Call it what you will, but I can never keep my mind in a single place. Your brain is composed of several thousand processors that make one or two functions. I engage myself in something, but keep my mind elsewhere, in some small way just to keep it there, and to my focus from being too much like tunnel-vision. One trained professional did try to hypnotize me once. I did everything he asked, and while I wanted to be hypnotized there was no singular movement of thought in my mind that made it possible for hypnosis to work. Essentially I'm a freak |
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| New Harumf | Dec 30 2008, 09:54 AM Post #5 |
Bloodthirsty Unicorn
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Hypnotism works, to some degree or another. Proven fact. Psychology works, to some degree or another. Proven fact. The ability to prescribe drugs helps the psychiatrist, this is true. Psychology, like sociology, works with generalizations, and may not be of any use on one individual, however, they can predict tendencies among like-minded individuals. My problem with all of these professions is the definition of "normal". I mean, if we are talking bell-curve normal, then we all fall out of the bell curve somewhere, but does everyone falling outside the bell curve on a given exam reflect the same reason? Not very likely. The human mind is very complicated and we are nowhere near understanding any of it. This, of course, is why I think hypnotism works. Not the cheap parlor trick ("cluck-like-a-chicken") hypnotism - that's BS, and all based on the willingness of the subject. We know behavioral modification works. Brainwashing is effective and has fully supported Pavlov's initial experiments. Hypnotism, on the other hand, as instant behavioral modification, like the cease-smoking stuff (I know three people that went through that program, and all three were smoking again in 2 years) is probably bullshit. I don't think you can hypnotise someone and in a half hour make them assassinate someone when they hear a bell. I think you can hypnotise someone to uncap subconcious thought, or regressed memories (if those memories are not planted by the hypnotist, which is why courts need to be very careful). Is a Mezmer type effect possible if you don't want it? I doubt it. If you do want it, then it can be effective. I have been hypnotized where I couldn't open my eyes, and I could do that to each of you. Simple trick. I could make my sleeping room mate in college remember a number when he woke up. Simple suggestion to his subconcious. Would I volunteer for an experiment in hypnotism? Sure, why not. Even for you, Nag, because I doubt I would have to worry about being made to do something I wouldn't want to do. Kind of how I've dealt with self-proclaimed witches and wizards in my life. I've met quite a few, even dated one or two, and when threatened, I always tell them to go ahead and do their best to put a curse on me, or enchant me. To date, nothing has ever worked because I don't believe anyone can curse me or cause me to do something that would harm me. Same thing, in my mind. There may be something to witchcraft and hypnotism, but in both cases you've got to believe it will work for anything to happen. [/ramble] |
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| Nag Ehgoeg | Jan 2 2009, 08:30 PM Post #6 |
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The Devil's Advocate
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Flumes: Psychology is a widely practiced discipline. Every health and social care professional in the UK has some level of psychological training. My girlfriend's brother is studying sports and recreation and I've helped him revise for his psychological modules. Psychology plays a big part in everyday life and pretty much everyone has some training in psychology. Problem is, as I see it, people only "learn" what's "relevant" to their job. And what's considered "relevant" is only ever one of perhaps half a dozen theories and they learn how to apply that theory without actually learning the reasoning behind it. So I kinda agree with you. I think the world would be better if there was more psychology in action. And, indeed, psychiatry (at the risk of becoming a society obsessed with pill popping). And I agree that counseling is a waste of time for some people (and that prescribing drugs isn't always the best way to solve mental problems). But if you ask around, you'll find that understanding of the human mind and human behaviour is being applied in practice across a huge range of professions and in all walks of everyday life. **** Ulgania: To grossly simplify things for a moment, there are two ways of inducing a hypnotic state. One of them is the "traditional" way that relies of relaxation ("you are feeling sleepy", follow the pocket watch, listen to this music etc). The other way is shock. Not an electrical shock but surprise. Catch a person with the right surprise at the right time and the brain (for want of a better word) shuts down and tries to reboot. It is notoriously difficult for people who think the way you claim to think to be lulled into a hypnotic state. But shock usually works very well. And you're not a freak. Little unusual maybe but it's not that uncommon for people to constantly think in multiple places at once. **** NH: Humanist psychologists would probably take huge objection to your definition of psychology using generalisations. But I see your point. Very valid. Cease smoking hypnotism program... they actually market that in the states? You'll have to forgive my haughty arrogance, but that sounds like a cheap con. I believe that hypnotism certainly can help a person quit smoking. But this is face to face hypnotism with a trained professional over the course of several weeks. I'd be interested to know the details of this program. Please forgive my ignorance, the way you referred to "that program" makes it seem like a common place thing in the States, but I got no idea what you're talking about. I'm thinking that this is because it's something really charlitan like "listen to this tape for a weeks and never smoke again, no willpower required" that would [be illegal to market/only have a really tiny niche market] in the UK. I also don't think you can hypnotise someone in half an hour to program them to assassinate someone. I do believe you could hypnotise someone and strongly encourage them to kill someone. Take this for example, someone comes to you for help, you implant false memories of sexual abuse and subtly encourage violent behaviour in this person. Neither encouraging violence or implanting false memories are impossible with hypnotism. You'd never be able to force your patient to kill anyone, and free will always plays a role, but you could certainly make action a lot more likely. I'd like to know the details behind this eye opening thing. That sounds interesting and a little far fetched. I doubt that it works as well as you're implying it works. Interesting to know that you mess with people while they sleep. Perv. :P Ah, I'm just kidding. But yeah that's the kind of thing that I've been doing until now. Looking to move up a little. I think I've set my sights a little high for my first project though. Can't find a willing test subject. [Parallels between magic and hypnotism not commented on.] |
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| NRE | Jan 2 2009, 09:17 PM Post #7 |
Map Tsar and Southern Gentleman
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I've always wanted to be Hypnotized, especially through one of those clinics where they use Hypnotism to make you eat less and therefore lose weight and I for one could use to shed a few pounds. I've only study psychology on the basic level, dabbling a little into human psychology (the development of a person from birth to old age) but other than that I have little interest in taking it further academically. An while I wouldn't mind further studying it on my own I'd probably need a scholar's help to fully understand it :P An thus I am stuck in a paradox |
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| Nag Ehgoeg | Jan 2 2009, 09:59 PM Post #8 |
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The Devil's Advocate
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Well... there's not an open course that you can take as a hobby? Like a Y course or an open community college type thing? I would have thought that Psych 101 would be fairly easy to take up as a casual study. But yeah, without a proper academic grounding you're pretty much stuck. It's not something that you can reliably learn about armed with google unless you understand the topic. |
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