| This forum is used with the NationStates web-game designed and run by Max Barry. While not officially affiliated, this serves as the regional forum for the regions: Middle East, African Continent, American Continent, Asian Continent, and European Continent. You're currently viewing our forum as a guest. This means you are limited to certain areas of the board and can "read only". In order to get the most out of these forums, please become a member and read this guide - http://z3.invisionfree.com/nationstates/index.php?showtopic=3060 If you're already a member please log in to your account to access all of our features: |
| America | |
|---|---|
| Topic Started: Apr 29 2008, 02:18 PM (969 Views) | |
| New Harumf | Apr 30 2008, 01:38 PM Post #26 |
Bloodthirsty Unicorn
|
Down with the King! Up with the rebels! |
 |
 
|
| flumes | Apr 30 2008, 03:19 PM Post #27 |
CLEVELAND ROCKS!
|
Not what I said.
"People" and "I" probably being the key word... Meaning I have a house, a car, food on the table... You get the idea. And since I have this in America, as most in America do. I really can't complain. My standard of living is great. I survive everyday. And I am happy. Taking it a step further, consider that America's poor aren't really poor on the global scale. Sure that is more the economic side then the social side to this debate. But I think it represents the point pretty well that America does pretty good for the American population. And that is the governments calling in a sense. |
|
|
|
| Nag Ehgoeg | Apr 30 2008, 03:26 PM Post #28 |
The Devil's Advocate
|
Still deluded. The ENTIRE FIRST WORLD enjoys those privilages. That's 20% of the world's "people" right there. Same for freedoms, rights etc. And if you think America doesn't have poor starving to death (or dying because they're not getting basic medical treatment) then you're beyond hope. |
|
|
|
| Sedulius | Apr 30 2008, 03:43 PM Post #29 |
Field Marshal
|
Seriously? You really need to go out and look at poverty for yourself. It's a horrible life. One I hope I never have to live again. It's bad enough now being middle class. We might as well be the rich's ragdolls. The standard of living is decreasing in the U.S. and there are definitely plenty of better places to live. People have even done the research, and the U.S. lost its place in the top ten long ago. And I'm certainly not happy in America. The people in general care only for themselves. I'll do my time in the Army, and if I see an opening in politics I'll take. Otherwise, hello Ireland, my true homeland! Yay! Hell, sometimes I feel I'd prefer Russia... and after thinking about that statement just now, I realized the U.S. really isn't much better nowadays. I mean, seriously, I live in a city of 100,000 and there's over 100 gangs here? What?! Meh, most of them are just a bunch of gangbangers with 22s. Me and Walley could easily take out with our weapons stockpile. :P I love AK-47s! and SKSs... and Mosins... and I want an SVD... |
|
|
|
| Menhad | Apr 30 2008, 04:15 PM Post #30 |
ET2(IDW)
|
Nag thats gotta be the greatest quote ever! hahahaha Any way, please lets try to keep this clean of the filth that we call our opinions(about health care and the death penalty) |
|
|
|
| Sedulius | Apr 30 2008, 04:42 PM Post #31 |
|
Field Marshal
|
*strokes chin* It is more fun to be a dictator... Actually a dictatorship in essence has the potential to be the best form of government. |
|
|
|
| Menhad | Apr 30 2008, 04:43 PM Post #32 |
|
ET2(IDW)
|
It depends on the dictator... |
|
|
|
| New Harumf | Apr 30 2008, 05:07 PM Post #33 |
|
Bloodthirsty Unicorn
|
Nag, will you quit on your "superior" medical system? There is a really good chance Flumes wouldn't be alive if he had to get on a waiting list in the UK for his brain surgery - here, he got it, and would have gotten it regardless of his insurance status. Plus our Churches and private charities feed the poor who want to take advantage of it - something pretty foreign for a society like yours that expects the government to take care of the problem. Also, you have many, many medical advances discovered and paid for by our expensive private medical facilities. All I have to do is wander over to the museum at the University of Michigan Med School and I can be astounded by the advances and discoveries done here, with private money backing the research. That's not even to mention the advances in pharmicuticals our not-free healthcare pays for. Also, I know for a fact you are no great fan of the system of "freedoms" and "liberties" you have in the UK, so - meh. Frodo |
|
|
|
| Assassin | Apr 30 2008, 05:14 PM Post #34 |
Field Marshal
|
I like America. I also dislike it. Various reasons. So chalk me up as a 'I don't care.' |
|
|
|
| Tristan da Cunha | Apr 30 2008, 05:19 PM Post #35 |
Science and Industry
|
I think the discussion so far misses the point, and is very short sighted. The horrible truth is that standard of living has decreased throughout the industrialized world and is going to take a nose dive in the next few years, due to the bursting of the real estate bubble, global food shortages leading to inflation, etc. Major governments in the developing world, such as China, will be rocked. Governments in the developed world will also suffer as increasing numbers of people fall into poverty, and the postwar peace will be disturbed like never before. Our quaint, idyllic childhood middle class lives we all knew and love will be gone forever. Chaos will reign, because the materialistic and self-absorbed modern people of the postwar world are mentally soft and unable to take the psychological trauma of having their standards of life drastically reduced. The tough and pious Great Depression generation, we're not. What we need to do is agree to a rally point so when the shit goes down we will all meet at the specified point, armed to the teeth, so that we can defend ourselves, our stash of canned food, and our lives. This is going to be Mad Max and the Thunderdome and we need to be prepared for it. |
|
|
|
| Assassin | Apr 30 2008, 05:26 PM Post #36 |
|
Field Marshal
|
Are you kidding me? I'm making a small empire up this way when everything goes to hell. I've already got a small armory going. :lol: And I may or may not have a couple hand grenades. ITS POSSIBLE, But I cannot confirm this at this time. |
|
|
|
| Tristan da Cunha | Apr 30 2008, 05:30 PM Post #37 |
|
Science and Industry
|
The Amish are going to be fucked. After society's collapse, the Amish will be the only group of people in America who actually know how to live off the land, and everyone is going to attack them to steal their food and supplies. If the Amish don't change their religious beliefs so they can arm themselves and fight off intruders, they'll be seriously fucked. |
|
|
|
| flumes | Apr 30 2008, 06:13 PM Post #38 |
|
CLEVELAND ROCKS!
|
:wacko: First off... My original statement regarding the 99% is being way misconstrued... And is getting off of the point...
I don't really want to get too specific. I am very fortunate to put it simply, I'm not going to go and brag to prove I am well off listing all the things the "first world" has. I thought the "you get the idea" would cover that... :rolleyes: Yeah, 99%, I am there, yay. Yes the "first world" countries other then the US have these same types of living standards for many. The point of my original post was never to say the US is better then the rest of the first world. Merely that I don't feel I have the right to complain about the US as it has given me the opportunity to have a wonderful life. Secondly, The US poor are not that bad off. The poor in the US eat. Period. If they don't, then they really are stubborn, or just plain stupid. PRIVATE charities we have here take care of things. Heck, even the government school food program is one of the most wonderful things I have seen when considered. Sure there is a difference between rich, middle class, and poor in the US. Poor do not live the same life, but it is a hell of a lot better then the majority of people living in third-world countries. Parents there would kill to send there kids to schools where they could eat. The US presents everyone with an opportunity, and that is what I love. The American Dream isn't dead. You just have to be willing to work, and have some luck. It isn't perfect. No where is. I am fortunate though, as most here are too whether they realize it or not. NH covered me on healthcare. :D I had Brain Surgery! I had insurance (praise jesus!) because that surely would've been tough (reinforcing a large middle class America......) but even if I hadn't they would've saved me. Hospitals here save lives first, come for payment second. The "healthcare crisis" here makes me laugh honestly. People say they are in poverty, they don't have that extra money for health insurance. Yet they could sacrifice plenty of luxuries to pay for it. It just comes down to the fact that standard of living is different here. What we consider poverty would not be bad in many other places around the world. It's not good by any means, but once again, your alive. Can you really complain when you look elsewhere and people can't say the same... Somewhat relating... Just interesting to consider regarding wealth spread around the world.. Interesting definitions of the words as well.. http://articles.moneycentral.msn.com/News/...gWealthGap.aspx So again, never said the "First World" isn't pretty close together. Just saying I can't complain, and I don't think many can. Siadhail, maybe there are better places. Fine, my personal preference say no to that, but for you maybe that is the case. I think we can both agree that there are a lot more worse places you could live then there are better places. EDIT: Long-ass rant FTW! :P ^_^ ;) |
|
|
|
| Toussaint | Apr 30 2008, 06:19 PM Post #39 |
Major
|
I hear ya. I'd rather be poor in the US than in Africa period. |
|
|
|
| lebowski2123 | Apr 30 2008, 06:46 PM Post #40 |
Resident?
|
Boy I am a fan of America, past a slight bit more then present. But what I say is Hell Yeah Capitalism, keep keeping on and helping us Americans to remain ahead of the stagnant, socialist economies of Europe (sorry people from Europe :rolleyes: ) |
|
|
|
| Assassin | Apr 30 2008, 08:16 PM Post #41 |
|
Field Marshal
|
Posted Image Somebody had to do it. Just saying. |
|
|
|
| Menhad | Apr 30 2008, 09:26 PM Post #42 |
|
ET2(IDW)
|
Couldn't have said it better. I grew up in the wellfare system, public schools, food stamps, the whole 9 yards(This is due to the fact that my dad's health insurance dropped him when they found out he got cancer, and the government said that they would pay the bill if we lived under poverty level). Its not the greatest system in the world, but I think it gets waaaaay more use in America than in Europe, and so it is not nearly as good. |
|
|
|
| Tristan da Cunha | May 1 2008, 12:25 AM Post #43 |
|
Science and Industry
|
Reduced-price school lunches FTW. I attended an inner city elementary school when my family was quite poor (we are not nearly as poor now). I think it was a good life experience especially during my formative years. I still retain a ghetto mentality about being cheap and never spending money. I think anyone should live some time in the ghetto, to learn the value of money and put middle class materialism into perspective, whether that middle class lifestyle is made possible by American-style robber baron capitalism or subsidized by a pinko socialist European government. "Pursuit of happiness" is a load of hogwash, and is why everyone is so fat, including Europeans. Pursuit of truth is what is permanent. |
|
|
|
| Rhadamanthus | May 1 2008, 12:38 AM Post #44 |
Legitimist
|
amen. |
|
|
|
| Catholic Europe | May 1 2008, 07:41 AM Post #45 |
Spammer
|
This is another thing I dislike about the majority of Americans and that is their blind patriotism. However, I can't believe you guys are painting the UK with the same brush that you are painting the rest of Europe (pinko-socialist governments). Not since the 1970's at the latest could we be called that (and I don't think we could ever be truely called that). Yes we have NHS etc but I work with a lot of Europeans (French, German, Spanish and Swedish) and they ALL complain about how this country (England) does nothing to help its citizens and instead expects them to get on with it on their own. Yes, that's right. That is what they said! The UK's system of doing things is the best in my opinion. It's not leaving you alone like in America and it's not doing everything for you like in Europe. And you guys know just how un-patriotic and anti-nationalism I am. |
|
|
|
| New Harumf | May 1 2008, 08:40 AM Post #46 |
|
Bloodthirsty Unicorn
|
OK, granted, under the inspired leadership of Maggie, the UK has managed to improve, but ever since the U.S. all but required you to resort to socialism after WWII, the big one, you have had your share of problems. You have too many people living on the dole (is that how it is spelled?). Your unions have all but destroyed several businesses, just as ours have - in our case, Auto, Steel, Textiles, Electronics; in your case, Textiles, Coal (I hear Welsh coal mines are having to import labor from other countries because Welshmen don't know how to mine any more), Steel, many others. You are, by our standards, still socialist, tho nowhere near as bad as France, Scandinavia, et al. |
|
|
|
| lebowski2123 | May 1 2008, 03:01 PM Post #47 |
|
Resident?
|
On a basic level, I don't know how you can claim that your nation isn't socialist and then concede that you have a nationalized healthcare program. |
|
|
|
| New Harumf | May 1 2008, 03:16 PM Post #48 |
|
Bloodthirsty Unicorn
|
I think he is talking in degrees. Compared to France, or Denmark, or others, it isn't THAT socialist! |
|
|
|
| Catholic Europe | May 1 2008, 03:16 PM Post #49 |
|
Spammer
|
Ask a Frenchman and I am sure that he would say that England is not socialist, nor does it have a socialist government. |
|
|
|
| Tristan da Cunha | May 1 2008, 03:26 PM Post #50 |
|
Science and Industry
|
The US has a nationalized healthcare program too, for the elderly and the poor. Socialism exists on a gradient of degrees. |
|
|
|
 |
|
| Go to Next Page | |
| « Previous Topic · Off-Topic · Next Topic » |
7:34 PM Jul 13