| This forum is used with the NationStates web-game designed and run by Max Barry. While not officially affiliated, this serves as the regional forum for the regions: Middle East, African Continent, American Continent, Asian Continent, and European Continent. You're currently viewing our forum as a guest. This means you are limited to certain areas of the board and can "read only". In order to get the most out of these forums, please become a member and read this guide - http://z3.invisionfree.com/nationstates/index.php?showtopic=3060 If you're already a member please log in to your account to access all of our features: |
| The Triumph of Orthodoxy | |
|---|---|
| Topic Started: Feb 10 2008, 10:43 PM (1,799 Views) | |
| Union | Mar 2 2008, 04:56 PM Post #51 |
![]()
Pyrenees Republic
|
"Should the Emperor be Dynastic, the majority of power should rest with the Roman Senate. Should the Emperor be elected, the majority of power may rest with him." |
![]() |
|
| Kasnyia | Mar 2 2008, 05:08 PM Post #52 |
|
Chairman of the Bank
|
These ideas of democracy sicken me. What point would it be to call it an Empire if the bloody Senate rules. Alexanderhaven will not partake in this alliance should it be ruled by such a devolved entity compared to her own government. |
![]() |
|
| NRE | Mar 2 2008, 09:51 PM Post #53 |
![]()
Map Tsar and Southern Gentleman
![]()
|
"Perhaps my brothers of faith" said the Tsar who had until this point sat back and weighed heavily the beliefs of both sides of the argument. "Perhaps, there is some sort of compromise that can be found to this issue of rule. I thank all who see fit to see my hereditary line to rule this new Empire. However, I also understand the concerns of those who would see the Roman Senate have more power and that the Emperor be elected. Perhaps, though I have no sounds suggestion as of yet, we could put in place some sort of safeguards that will ensure that the Emperor or whatever body is to rule the Empire cannot step outside the will of the Roman people or the church." |
![]() |
|
| Devin Wire | Mar 2 2008, 11:29 PM Post #54 |
![]()
Captain
|
"I ask that we at least spend some time discussing the way in which our economic operations shall be funded. I trust that time is something we have; a divinely inspired mission is granted such luxury." |
![]() |
|
| Kasnyia | Mar 3 2008, 12:08 AM Post #55 |
|
Chairman of the Bank
|
The territories of the empire do what is best for each state in regards to economics and then all states pay 10% of their treasure to the Emperor. |
![]() |
|
| Union | Mar 3 2008, 06:29 AM Post #56 |
![]()
Pyrenees Republic
|
"All states should pay for all the Empire's administrative, not military, costs within their respective territories. The Empire should take what is necessary, but no more. A flat rate of 10% encourages waste. Military costs should be shared by those who benefit the most. If there is a military campaign in Georgia, Russia should pay for most of it. If there is a military campaign in Iberia, Hispania would do so." |
![]() |
|
| Devin Wire | Mar 3 2008, 11:15 AM Post #57 |
![]()
Captain
|
"Perhaps it best to keep, then, administrative costs to their lowest possible. The Administration should primarily exist to serve the needs of the Church and of God." |
![]() |
|
| Kasnyia | Mar 3 2008, 01:50 PM Post #58 |
|
Chairman of the Bank
|
And if Scythirus should invade Alexanderhaven? Not all states are great military monoliths. The Empire is one nation. Any part of it comes to attack, all should defend it. We stand by the flat tax of 10%. As for the suggestion to streamline administration, Alexanderhaven agrees and has already put that in effect in our own country. |
![]() |
|
| Union | Mar 3 2008, 04:13 PM Post #59 |
![]()
Pyrenees Republic
|
"Is the Empire going to fund Hispania's education system? Health-care? Local military? Energy imports? What about their police forces, or provincial grants? What about Hispania's administrative costs? Hispania does not operate on a budget surplus, and cannot pay on a flat rate, unless the Empire is willing to pay for Hispanic programs it must sacrifice. Why should small rich states pay more than large, poor ones? A nation should pay for whatever administrative and military costs their nations cost from the Empire, and not one cent more. If Alexanderhaven requires defense, then it pays for that defense as the Empire gives it, to a point. This has several advantages - as each nation must foot the bill for their actions, less nations will pursue reckless foriegn policy, safe behind the might of the Empire. The Empire will be dragged into fewer needless wars, and needless costs. Nations that do not require as much assistance from the Empire will not be taxed as much as a nation which enters a war once a year. This is the only fair way to do it. Any other method, such as a flat tax, is sheer lunacy." |
![]() |
|
| Quaon | Mar 3 2008, 04:50 PM Post #60 |
![]()
A Prince Amoung Men-Shoot First and Ask Questions Later
|
"Perhaps, instead of taking the tax out of each nation's treasury, we should impose a direct income tax on the citizens of the Empire, or perhaps some sort of sales tax? This is only an idea, as this matter of economics is not my forte." |
![]() |
|
| Union | Mar 3 2008, 04:57 PM Post #61 |
![]()
Pyrenees Republic
|
"That would create another level of beauracracy. The simplest solution is for each nation in the Roman Commonwealth to fund programs it is directly involved in, and that occur within its borders. |
![]() |
|
| Devin Wire | Mar 4 2008, 01:34 PM Post #62 |
![]()
Captain
|
"My fellow members of the Communal Eastern Church; must we bicker and present Keyensian solutions? Allow the Church, and charity to finance such matters." |
![]() |
|
| NRE | Mar 6 2008, 10:41 AM Post #63 |
![]()
Map Tsar and Southern Gentleman
![]()
|
"I find King Hannibal's solution to be most agreeable." said the Tsar. "A nation within the Empire should not be imposed to help another nation as this current junction. It should be pointed out that at the conception of this Empire we stand as divided and different states. Each with an economy unique unto itself and we must better understand these economies before we the whole of the Empire to stand as one. For now it seems best that each nation within the Empire should only be required to pay for the amenities that it requires from the Empire. This will ensure that no nation becomes a burden on the rest, bringing down what will surely be a fragile Imperial economy at the beginning. In time as the Empire grows economically and we have had the chance to study one another's economic situations more thoroughly, this can be changed." The Tsar turned to Tobias "an in the case of such nations as Alexanderhaven, who does not have a strong military as others but would be forced to pay the larger share of any military spending that would occur should that said nation be attack, a charity system could be put in place. Perhaps funded by the church, to help relieve the economic burden or war and lower the debt of such an operation. This all of course is just a suggestion, an idea that has come to me during these discussion. I do hope we can come to some agreement as I believe we should return to the more pressing matter of administration for the Empire." |
![]() |
|
| Kasnyia | Mar 6 2008, 12:47 PM Post #64 |
|
Chairman of the Bank
|
OOC- Its Archbishop Michael speaking, not Tobias. Tobias is sitting silently with other things on his mind. Namely trying to find a bride. :lol: IC- And then how shall the church conduct its own affairs with the people if all its money is thrown into funding the military? The Church is not a bank and I am not a banker! The Scythirans could easily crush Alexanderhaven if we have to pay to have our own brothers defend us! Even now, the look at our coasts with bloodlust. I fear that we may be next after Georgia. I cannot accept to deliver this suggestion to my King. It just isn't possible. Either we accept this as an alliance and leave it as such, with the typical responsibiliies of an alliance, or we consolidate into Empire. This half-measure is far too unwieldy and plays as a security blanket for strong states and as a great burden on the weak states. |
![]() |
|
| Quaon | Mar 6 2008, 04:53 PM Post #65 |
![]()
A Prince Amoung Men-Shoot First and Ask Questions Later
|
Archbishop Epiphonias spoke up. "I believe that there are some things that the imperial government must subsidize for it to be effective. The Imperial Military ought to be financed by the Empire directly and without bias. Since any Imperial Military action would be a defensive action without the consent of the entire Empire, it would be unfair for a state to have to pay a greater share than normal for its defense. In fact, such a state would be better off staying independent in some ways. Now, there are certain things that should be financed by each state, such as education. The military is not one of these things. "Now to the proposition that the Orthodox Church ought to pay for military matters. This is outrageous. To ask the Church to finance secular wars will bleed the Church dry. Also, to the question of succession, I believe that it should be dynastic, but I also believe that the Emperor must be ratified by the various hierarchs of the Orthodox Church." |
![]() |
|
| NRE | Mar 6 2008, 10:18 PM Post #66 |
![]()
Map Tsar and Southern Gentleman
![]()
|
OOC: Oops my bad :P IC: "My brothers of faith I apologize for not being clear on my suggestion about the church. I did not mean to suggest the church should help fund wars as certainly that is an absurd notion. I simply meant to suggest that while a nation would need to divert their finances to war, the church could step in and raise money to hep fund other sectors of that nation's government, those sectors essential with the well-being of that nation's citizens. These funds do not and should not come from the direct treasury of the church but perhaps from fundraisers to church sponsors. Again though this was just a suggestion and I did not mean to offend anyone with my suggestion." |
![]() |
|
| Quaon | Mar 16 2008, 03:44 PM Post #67 |
![]()
A Prince Amoung Men-Shoot First and Ask Questions Later
|
OOC: Guys, let's get the ball rolling here. |
![]() |
|
| Rhadamanthus | Mar 16 2008, 03:46 PM Post #68 |
|
Legitimist
![]()
|
OOC: Where are we? Perhaps we could get a list of what needs to be addressed? |
![]() |
|
| Union | Mar 21 2008, 09:03 AM Post #69 |
![]()
Pyrenees Republic
|
King Hannibal rose, and presented a document. "This is the Constitution that Hispania would desire most. Changes are marked within the text."
|
![]() |
|
| Quaon | Mar 21 2008, 09:18 AM Post #70 |
![]()
A Prince Amoung Men-Shoot First and Ask Questions Later
|
"I agree with the Hispanic revisions, except this one:
"I believe that each member state should have some degree of autonomy in foreign affairs." |
![]() |
|
| Union | Mar 21 2008, 09:23 AM Post #71 |
![]()
Pyrenees Republic
|
That is merely so no conflict arises with the Treaty of Konigsberg, of which several Romans are members, which demands memberstates be part of only one organization. |
![]() |
|
| NRE | Mar 22 2008, 10:19 PM Post #72 |
![]()
Map Tsar and Southern Gentleman
![]()
|
"I understand our concerns about the ToK, however I feel that the nations not represented here in the ToK will be understanding of our decision to forge this Empire and though I cannot guarantee it, I believe some sort of compromise can be made which would allow us to remain friendly with ToK. Perhaps an cooperation pack can be made between the Empire, once it is formed, at the ToK which would allow members of both groups to reap the benefits of both organizations. It would in, my opinion, certainly be beneficial for both organizations to work together. An this would allow us to thus operate independently in the matter of foreign affairs." |
![]() |
|
| Kasnyia | Mar 22 2008, 10:26 PM Post #73 |
|
Chairman of the Bank
|
We are either to be an empire or an alliance. Not some half-breed of both. As an Empire, all foreign relations desicions should be made by the Emperor and only the Emperor. If we are an alliance, then there is no need to forge this union any further. If by forging the Empire we must forsake the Treaty of Konigsberg, so be it. Otherwise, let us not waste time any further with this talk of union, if the provinces of the empire are effectively independant of the Emperor's rule. Should this democratically created imperium come into existance, know that it will be a poor mockery of the original. Alexanderhaven will not back an Empire where the Emperor, in this case the Tsar, is equal to the provincial kings. |
![]() |
|
| Devin Wire | Mar 22 2008, 11:29 PM Post #74 |
![]()
Captain
|
The words that are being spoken are now far too harsh; have we forgotten why we are here? The Empire should, before anything else, primarily exist to serve the greater glory of God. |
![]() |
|
| Kasnyia | Mar 22 2008, 11:31 PM Post #75 |
|
Chairman of the Bank
|
Indeed it should, but it must do so efficiently. Rule by mob is the most inefficient way to carry out God's word and God's wishes. |
![]() |
|
| Go to Next Page | |
| « Previous Topic · Inter-regional Relations · Next Topic » |











11:36 AM Jul 13