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The God Thread, Version 2.0
Topic Started: Jun 26 2006, 06:52 PM (1,077 Views)
Quaon
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A Prince Amoung Men-Shoot First and Ask Questions Later
Nag Ehgoeg
Jul 6 2006, 04:49 PM
Then why are two athiests argueing over the Christian faith?

And why aren't you paying attension.

The key, fundemental part, of my arguement is where an Apostle says "believe on" they mean "believe totally and completely in Jesus and follow his teachings" not "believe he lived". There's no contradiction there.

John 11:26
 
And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die.


Another from Mark (12)
 
30And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment.

Look, I just damn don't know...you win this argument...dammit!
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Nag Ehgoeg
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The Devil's Advocate

Look, I wanted to stop this arguement like 3 pages back.

But I will just say this, if you believe in Kergima and worship Jesus as the Apostles do, then you are safe. You will go to heaven.

Why? Because the Apostles gave up all their material possessions to follow Jesus. They followed the ten commandments, and the teachings of Jesus. They spent their lives, as Jesus commanded, ministering and following in his example.

They gave up their lives on Earth for reward in heaven out of complete love and belief in Jesus.

He who is first shall be last, and he who was last shall be first in the Kingdom of Heaven.

Of course, I believe after we die, that's it. Poof. You're gone. So you won't see me wasting my life.
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New Harumf
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Bloodthirsty Unicorn
You are undoubtedly right - God is nothing but a chemical reaction in our brain, and when we die, poof, we cease to be, God ceases to be, even the world ceases to be. We, and God, return to the hydrogen, oxygen, carbon and trace metals that we started as.

That fact, however, does not dismiss the truth that there is a God.
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NRE
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Map Tsar and Southern Gentleman

Wadj
Jul 6 2006, 12:39 PM
I'm so tired of God threads.

I swear, if there's another theological discussion, I'll build a doomsday device with Le Congo Leopold and fill this world with Cobalt-Thorium G up to its ears!

:lol: The Eastern Empire will gladly help
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Nag Ehgoeg
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The Devil's Advocate

New Harumf
Jul 7 2006, 09:43 AM
You are undoubtedly right - God is nothing but a chemical reaction in our brain, and when we die, poof, we cease to be, God ceases to be, even the world ceases to be. We, and God, return to the hydrogen, oxygen, carbon and trace metals that we started as.

That fact, however, does not dismiss the truth that there is a God.

That's the kind of god I won't deny three times.

Also, if a man accepts Jesus as the son of god who died for our sins, then goes out and kills a bunch of people - does he go to heaven as per Filo's Kergima?

That's not a personal attack, I'm actually curious. I'll say more tomorrow.
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Quaon
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A Prince Amoung Men-Shoot First and Ask Questions Later
Luke
Chapter 23, Verses 39-43
39One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him: "Aren't you the Christ? Save yourself and us!"

40But the other criminal rebuked him. "Don't you fear God," he said, "since you are under the same sentence? 41We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve. But this man has done nothing wrong."

42Then he said, "Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.[a]"

43Jesus answered him, "I tell you the truth, today you will be with me in paradise."

The criminal did not live a life of poverty, but merely asked forgiveness.
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Filo
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General
Nag Ehgoeg
Jul 7 2006, 03:49 PM
New Harumf
Jul 7 2006, 09:43 AM
You are undoubtedly right - God is nothing but a chemical reaction in our brain, and when we die, poof, we cease to be, God ceases to be, even the world ceases to be.  We, and God, return to the hydrogen, oxygen, carbon and trace metals that we started as.

That fact, however, does not dismiss the truth that there is a God.

That's the kind of god I won't deny three times.

Also, if a man accepts Jesus as the son of god who died for our sins, then goes out and kills a bunch of people - does he go to heaven as per Filo's Kergima?

That's not a personal attack, I'm actually curious. I'll say more tomorrow.

I wont to restart discussion but i see that you have not teke my point.
I'am not sayng that simply sayng "Master" a people goes in the heaven.
I'am telling that accepting the Kerigma i accept all the message of Christ and more of all his love.
Love that i must give tio the others(Chi perde la vita la trova e chi trova la vita la perde).
I'm sayng that if i know that Jesus love me i need no holy books(not normally but as extreme exemple).
Many catholic saints DON'T Know the bibble but love a life of Charity and love only acceptiong that Jesus is born dead and resurrect for them.


I'm not rejecting Jesus Teaching but sayng that Books are less important that Love.
If I truly love Jesus and Brothers i cannot goes outside and kills people also if i NEVER read a single line of the Bibble or NEVER hear a mass in all my life.

If i have Charity and Faith i have all(as says Paul)

Its clear now ? or you need some more explanation?
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The CNNP
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Enforcer
I don't think there is any secret that I am (or try to be ^_^ ) a devout follower of God and Christ. I will make it no secret that I am a devout Roman Catholic. My personaly opinion on the matter is "to each his own". My personal life experiences have led me to believe that God does exist and his mercy is abundant, because technically I should be in prison. A young buck youth blaming everybody and society for my shortcomings in life, until I took it too far. To this day why that officer work with me and did all he could to be a mentor and find a "break" in the judicial system for me, I will never know. All I do know is that God must have touched this man to help deliver me from a life of perpetual wrong doing. That is all for me.
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Nag Ehgoeg
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The Devil's Advocate

Quaon
Jul 7 2006, 04:16 PM
Luke
Chapter 23, Verses 39-43
39One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him: "Aren't you the Christ? Save yourself and us!"

40But the other criminal rebuked him. "Don't you fear God," he said, "since you are under the same sentence? 41We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve. But this man has done nothing wrong."

42Then he said, "Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.[a]"

43Jesus answered him, "I tell you the truth, today you will be with me in paradise."

The criminal did not live a life of poverty, but merely asked forgiveness.

Ah, but consider then this: that criminal didn't have a chance to break god's commandments after accepting Christ.

"Don't you fear God?"

That criminal accepted that the life he had led was wrong.
He accepted that he was being punished justly.
He accept that Jesus was Lord, and knowing he had broken with Jesus's teachings, he repented.

Now the fact that you don't think a thief being crucified wasn't poor doesn't do too much for your case here...

I'm not saying you must live a perfect life.

Jesus was the only one (supposedly) who lived such a perfect life. And if you truely repent (and make amends where possible), then you will find heaven.

But you must accept Jesus's teachings. You must accept that you are imperfect. You must genuinely wish to change.

He didn't "merely ask for forgiveness" he DIED on a cross for his life of sin, along side Jesus. Jesus told his followers to carry their crosses - and this follower died on his.

That's the ultimate act of contrition.

While one thief still rejected the teachings of Christ and sought to escape, the other accepted his fate and resigned himself by making amends (the only way he could - by dying in one of the most painful ways possible).

Now, Filo doesn't want to be dragged back into this, but so I'll let his comment go without comment. But that's not to say I agree.
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New Harumf
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Bloodthirsty Unicorn
Nag Ehgoeg
Jul 8 2006, 09:41 AM
Quaon
Jul 7 2006, 04:16 PM
Luke
Chapter 23, Verses 39-43
39One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him: "Aren't you the Christ? Save yourself and us!"

40But the other criminal rebuked him. "Don't you fear God," he said, "since you are under the same sentence? 41We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve. But this man has done nothing wrong."

42Then he said, "Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.[a]"

43Jesus answered him, "I tell you the truth, today you will be with me in paradise."

The criminal did not live a life of poverty, but merely asked forgiveness.

Ah, but consider then this: that criminal didn't have a chance to break god's commandments after accepting Christ.

"Don't you fear God?"

That criminal accepted that the life he had led was wrong.
He accepted that he was being punished justly.
He accept that Jesus was Lord, and knowing he had broken with Jesus's teachings, he repented.

Now the fact that you don't think a thief being crucified wasn't poor doesn't do too much for your case here...

I'm not saying you must live a perfect life.

Jesus was the only one (supposedly) who lived such a perfect life. And if you truely repent (and make amends where possible), then you will find heaven.

But you must accept Jesus's teachings. You must accept that you are imperfect. You must genuinely wish to change.

He didn't "merely ask for forgiveness" he DIED on a cross for his life of sin, along side Jesus. Jesus told his followers to carry their crosses - and this follower died on his.

That's the ultimate act of contrition.

While one thief still rejected the teachings of Christ and sought to escape, the other accepted his fate and resigned himself by making amends (the only way he could - by dying in one of the most painful ways possible).

Now, Filo doesn't want to be dragged back into this, but so I'll let his comment go without comment. But that's not to say I agree.

One of my short plays is written on this very topic, which I sent to CE for input, to which he never replied. :angry:

Anyway, I would love input, so anyone that might ACTUALLY read it, PM me with an e-mail, and I'll send a .doc of the play.
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Nag Ehgoeg
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The Devil's Advocate

Pwwt, you've got my email.
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Quaon
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A Prince Amoung Men-Shoot First and Ask Questions Later
New Harumf
Jul 8 2006, 10:49 AM
Nag Ehgoeg
Jul 8 2006, 09:41 AM
Quaon
Jul 7 2006, 04:16 PM
Luke
Chapter 23, Verses 39-43
39One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him: "Aren't you the Christ? Save yourself and us!"

40But the other criminal rebuked him. "Don't you fear God," he said, "since you are under the same sentence? 41We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve. But this man has done nothing wrong."

42Then he said, "Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.[a]"

43Jesus answered him, "I tell you the truth, today you will be with me in paradise."

The criminal did not live a life of poverty, but merely asked forgiveness.

Ah, but consider then this: that criminal didn't have a chance to break god's commandments after accepting Christ.

"Don't you fear God?"

That criminal accepted that the life he had led was wrong.
He accepted that he was being punished justly.
He accept that Jesus was Lord, and knowing he had broken with Jesus's teachings, he repented.

Now the fact that you don't think a thief being crucified wasn't poor doesn't do too much for your case here...

I'm not saying you must live a perfect life.

Jesus was the only one (supposedly) who lived such a perfect life. And if you truely repent (and make amends where possible), then you will find heaven.

But you must accept Jesus's teachings. You must accept that you are imperfect. You must genuinely wish to change.

He didn't "merely ask for forgiveness" he DIED on a cross for his life of sin, along side Jesus. Jesus told his followers to carry their crosses - and this follower died on his.

That's the ultimate act of contrition.

While one thief still rejected the teachings of Christ and sought to escape, the other accepted his fate and resigned himself by making amends (the only way he could - by dying in one of the most painful ways possible).

Now, Filo doesn't want to be dragged back into this, but so I'll let his comment go without comment. But that's not to say I agree.

One of my short plays is written on this very topic, which I sent to CE for input, to which he never replied. :angry:

Anyway, I would love input, so anyone that might ACTUALLY read it, PM me with an e-mail, and I'll send a .doc of the play.

Hey, can you send me it? My email is QuaonDilstarLightman@gmail.com
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