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Recognition of Paradise / Oaksendom borders
Topic Started: Apr 14 2005, 03:31 PM (357 Views)
Paradise
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Resident bureaucrat

Oaksendom and I are requesting that the currently occupied zones of UAE and Eastern Oman become fully incorporated into our respective countries. Those territories have been occupied / administered long enough IMO...

Any objection to that?
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The Socialist Sheikdom of Egyria
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The Holy Prussian Empire
((Egyria would object if that happened and Egyria's annexation of the Fourth Cataract was not recognized. Otherwise, no problem))
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Paradise
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Resident bureaucrat

Egyria, those territories were annexed more than one year ago. Your nation wasn't even created at that time...

Also, don't forget Paradise is 5 billion inhabitants while Egyria is about 700 millions. IMO, you occupy too much land now regarding your actual small population.
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New Harumf
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Paradise
Apr 14 2005, 03:49 PM
Egyria, those territories were annexed more than one year ago. Your nation wasn't even created at that time...

Also, don't forget Paradise is 5 billion inhabitants while Egyria is about 700 millions. IMO, you occupy too much land now regarding your actual small population.

OOC: All I can say to that is "Harumf!"
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Rhadamanthus
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Legitimist

Those lands have been under the administration of Oaksendom and Paradise for as long as I can remember, and probably as long as the Resplendent Dawn has existed. I have always thought of those lands as Oaksendom and Paradise's lands, so the Resplendent Dawn offers no protest and will recognize the claims.

However, on the regional map page, Patrua is the nation listed as not recognizing the occupations. So I think that it is Patrua whom you will have to convince.
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Patrua
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Captain

"The Empire was lenient before when Dar al-Harb's territory was mercilessly annexed by Paradise. When later the very same happened with the UEA territories, again, Paradise was quick to claim annexation but without getting the international recognition they so desperately craved. We have no guarantee that this imperialist and expansionist tendency wil lever cease and already fear the worst for if United Elias should ever fall victim to anarchy. It comes as no surprise that Egyria -already bigger in territorial size than Patrua and many other large nations are and yet taking every opportunity to expand even further- is the first to put forward its own claims again. If a long period of administration is the sole premisses on which expansion is condoned, then Legionistan and Kaduiri should become integral parts of the Empire of Patrua too, for they are governed by us for way longer than Dar al-Harb and the UAE are by Paradise and Salicia and Egypt by United Elias. Are the other nations willing to accept the Patruan Empire to expand by Legionistan and Kaduiri? I don't think that Catholic Europe to name one would. We will continue to put our veto to unbridled and continuous expansion, but we are willing to listen to Paradisian and Oaksendom arguments as to why we should. Either through closed-channel diplomacy or through public statements like these."

Enid Guava, President of the Committee of Foreign Affairs


OOC.
If everyone keeps expanding, then there will be no favourable and interesting spots left for new arrivals. Let's keep some of them free, shall we. And yeah, Egyria received a lot of land when being put on the map. Under my mapmaking reign of terror, the rule stood that you could ask to expand if you started off small and you couldn't if you got a sizeable part to start with. Just to keep the playing field levelled a bit and to allow new dudes some land in the interesting bits instead of the marginal areas.
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The Socialist Sheikdom of Egyria
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The Holy Prussian Empire
((I have half of Egypt and a tiny strip in Syria. How is that so ginormous? Especially considering the majority of it is desert))
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Rhadamanthus
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Legitimist

Patrua
Apr 14 2005, 07:06 PM
OOC.
If everyone keeps expanding, then there will be no favourable and interesting spots left for new arrivals. Let's keep some of them free, shall we.

That is a good point, and one that deserves more consideration.
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Paradise
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Resident bureaucrat

UAE and Western Oman were indeed invaded by Paradise and Oaksendom for imperialistic reasons, but not exclusively. Anarchy was reaching our borders and it was unacceptable.

There are many good reasons now to recognize our annexation:
1. The order has been re-established;
2. The region is mostly arab and sunni muslim (just like the rest of Paradise);
3. UAE and Northern Oman are de facto an integral part of Paradise;
4. Paradise has no intention to ever invade its old friend United Elias, we even plan to sign non-aggression pacts with all our neighbours (namely United Elias, Oaksendom and Patrua);
5. Paradise is willing to recognize the annexation of Kaduiri, but not Legionistan (it would be a geographic nonsense).
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Oaksendom
Unregistered

We agree with the following points made by Paradise:

1. The order has been re-established;
2. The region is mostly arab and sunni muslim (just like the rest of Paradise);
3. UAE and Northern Oman are de facto an integral part of Paradise;
4. Paradise has no intention to ever invade its old friend United Elias, we even plan to sign non-aggression pacts with all our neighbours (namely United Elias, Oaksendom and Patrua);
5. Paradise is willing to recognize the annexation of Kaduiri, but not Legionistan (it would be a geographic nonsense).

Patrua's expansion into Legionistan is a little odd. We would like to know why Patrua would like to do this. It would be a logistical nightmare to run (reminiscent of the old United Arab Republic).

The city of Salalah and the Dhofari region in general is effectively a part of Oaksendom already.

We have also consulted the leader of the former Dar al-Harb (with whom we were at University) and she feels that the conclusion of the border between Paradise and Oaksendom is timely.

Our government has earmarked several funds for the economic and social development of Dhofar and we see this development as necessary and, well, obvious.

We would like to thank our friends and allies for their support with this.

Best regards,

Ra'is Hamad

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Rhadamanthus
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Legitimist

Guys, I think Patrua has been misinterpreted. I don't think he wants to expand into Kaduiri or Legionistan. He is using those as examples of territories that have been administered by his nation, but which he is not annexing.
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Patrua
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Paradise
Apr 14 2005, 06:50 PM
There are many good reasons now to recognize our annexation:
1. The order has been re-established;
2. The region is mostly arab and sunni muslim (just like the rest of Paradise);
3. UAE and Northern Oman are de facto an integral part of Paradise;
4. Paradise has no intention to ever invade its old friend United Elias, we even plan to sign non-aggression pacts with all our neighbours (namely United Elias, Oaksendom and Patrua);
5. Paradise is willing to recognize the annexation of Kaduiri, but not Legionistan (it would be a geographic nonsense).

The very same reasons apply to Patrua in administering Legionistan and Kaduiri and that for a period preceding yours by long:

1. The order has been re-established;
2. The region is mostly african and secular (just like the rest of Patrua);
3. Kaduiri and Legionistan are de facto an integral part of Patrua;
4. Patrua has no intention to invade its neighbours, we would welcome non-aggression pacts with all of them;

Paradise
Apr 15 2005, 09:18 AM
5. Paradise is willing to recognize the annexation of Kaduiri, but not Legionistan (it would be a geographic nonsense).

Oh yes? Suddenly geography plays a role? Most peculiar, because it wasn't previously mentioned among the other conditions. How come that adjacency must be a prerequisite?

Oaksendom
Apr 15 2005, 09:18 AM
Patrua's expansion into Legionistan is a little odd. We would like to know why Patrua would like to do this. It would be a logistical nightmare to run (reminiscent of the old United Arab Republic).

We've been doing this for far longer than you had to administer the nearby lands. It is no more difficult than it is for Egyptian Egyria and Syrian Egyria or France and French Guyana.
Patrua is quite well capable of continuing the administration and can proceed with its incorporation into the Empire without much trouble.
Again, it is odd that you would perceive it only as logical that an adjacent territory is annexed but that a separate territory that just as well meets all the conditions you put forward, is being labelled as geographical nonsense.
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Catholic Europe
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Catholic Europe has absolutely no problems with Paradise and Oaksendom taking over these lands.

However, Egyria, you really do have far too much land and I would personally liek to see you banned from expanding for at least a year.
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Paradise
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Resident bureaucrat

Patrua
Apr 17 2005, 06:56 AM
Paradise
Apr 14 2005, 06:50 PM
There are many good reasons now to recognize our annexation:
1. The order has been re-established;
2. The region is mostly arab and sunni muslim (just like the rest of Paradise);
3. UAE and Northern Oman are de facto an integral part of Paradise;
4. Paradise has no intention to ever invade its old friend United Elias, we even plan to sign non-aggression pacts with all our neighbours (namely United Elias, Oaksendom and Patrua);
5. Paradise is willing to recognize the annexation of Kaduiri, but not Legionistan (it would be a geographic nonsense).

The very same reasons apply to Patrua in administering Legionistan and Kaduiri and that for a period preceding yours by long:

1. The order has been re-established;
2. The region is mostly african and secular (just like the rest of Patrua);
3. Kaduiri and Legionistan are de facto an integral part of Patrua;
4. Patrua has no intention to invade its neighbours, we would welcome non-aggression pacts with all of them;

Paradise
Apr 15 2005, 09:18 AM
5. Paradise is willing to recognize the annexation of Kaduiri, but not Legionistan (it would be a geographic nonsense).

Oh yes? Suddenly geography plays a role? Most peculiar, because it wasn't previously mentioned among the other conditions. How come that adjacency must be a prerequisite?

Oaksendom
Apr 15 2005, 09:18 AM
Patrua's expansion into Legionistan is a little odd. We would like to know why Patrua would like to do this. It would be a logistical nightmare to run (reminiscent of the old United Arab Republic).

We've been doing this for far longer than you had to administer the nearby lands. It is no more difficult than it is for Egyptian Egyria and Syrian Egyria or France and French Guyana.
Patrua is quite well capable of continuing the administration and can proceed with its incorporation into the Empire without much trouble.
Again, it is odd that you would perceive it only as logical that an adjacent territory is annexed but that a separate territory that just as well meets all the conditions you put forward, is being labelled as geographical nonsense.

Oh if you take it that way, we'll just continue to "administer" those territories ad vitam eternam :rolleyes:
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Catholic Europe
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Paradise
Apr 17 2005, 11:57 AM
Oh if you take it that way, we'll just continue to "administer" those territories ad vitam eternam :rolleyes:

We must be PC about these things lol.
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Paradise
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Resident bureaucrat

PC?
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Rhadamanthus
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Legitimist

Politically Correct
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Catholic Europe
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Paradise
Apr 17 2005, 03:54 PM
PC?

Lol, sorry, forgot that we aren't all native English speakers on this forum.
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Patrua
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Paradise
Apr 17 2005, 11:57 AM
Oh if you take it that way, we'll just continue to "administer" those territories ad vitam eternam :rolleyes:

Patrua knew you weren't prepared to pay hard dividends in return. Nice political answer though, Patrua reciprocates that one.
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Oaksendom
Unregistered

Oh well...

Those poor people in our administered lands. It really is no solution for them.

Who is going to think about the children?

Won't somebody think about the children?

We would really like a solution to this one. Come on, Patrua, think of the children. You know the people want defined borders and some sense of stability and security in their lives....

Lola Kandida,
Minister for Silky Sheen

and

Fawzia bint Mohammed al-Balushi
Minister of St. Patrick's Day
:ph43r:
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Patrua
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Captain

*thinks about children*

:(

*sobs*

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Patrua
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"We are glad to see that Oaksendom too is willing to strive for a solution, yet we still do not fully comprehend why they would oppose our Legionistani assets when the only de facto difference with the UAE territories is the lack of adjacency. One wonders why we should be humane and consider the uncertainty of people's lives in UAE while no thought should be given to the people living in former Legionistan. One wonders indeed."

Enid Guava, President of the Committee of Foreign Affairs

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Oaksendom
Unregistered

Fair enough. We are convinced.

What about everyone else?

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Catholic Europe
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Patrua
Apr 21 2005, 06:16 AM
"We are glad to see that Oaksendom too is willing to strive for a solution, yet we still do not fully comprehend why they would oppose our Legionistani assets when the only de facto difference with the UAE territories is the lack of adjacency. One wonders why we should be humane and consider the uncertainty of people's lives in UAE while no thought should be given to the people living in former Legionistan. One wonders indeed."

Enid Guava, President of the Committee of Foreign Affairs

Catholic Europe would be bothered about Former Legionistan but we have more pressing issues at the moment.
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Oaksendom
Unregistered

Oh well... A solution is yet to be reached...

Those poor children.

We will have to cancel Ballet Week (with Petrov Dremeditov) in the administered territories now.

Colonel Bob "Buckaroo" Flemming (the Flatulent)
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