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Magic @ Wizards; 3/5, 7 PM, Verizon Center
Topic Started: Mar 5 2008, 01:19 AM (3,863 Views)
Ben Q Rock
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3QC
Just the facts:

Arroyo/Bogans 3-2
Arroyo/Dooling 0-1 (how surprising :rolleyes:)
Arroyo/Evans 9-2
Nelson/Bogans 19-11
Nelson/Evans 9-7
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iceveins333
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Rocks blocking shots on guys with dreadlocks
brutalfacts is right, sure we probably will win 50 games but w/ nelson/arroyo being the starting PG we arent gonna be a serious title contending threat
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MagicMadness
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Not to debate Nogaro, but just pointing out that looking at Ben's stats (thanks for posting those, by the way), the Magic are 28-18 when Nelson starts.

That means they're winning about 61% of the time when Nelson starts - or 50 games out of 82. So technically, magiclive would be right.

However, as has been pointed out numerous times by many of us here, the clubs record has been more a result of our big 3, rather than who starts at PG.
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magiclive
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Nogaro
Mar. 5, 2008 11:59 PM
magiclive
Mar. 5, 2008 11:39 PM
If we play .500 ball the rest of the way, this team will have 50 wins. Does anyone else remember the all-knowing Brutalfacts who said this team has no chance of being a 50-win team unless they get new PGs? He said as long as Jameer is the starter, we will never be a 50-win team. I agree that Jameer is probably not the long-term answer, but I'm sure Brutal's starting to get the crow out on the dinner table.

We still have 19 games left. So nothing's certain just yet. But this team is capable of winning 50 games and that alone proves the "really smart guy" on this board wrong. There's no reason why we can't win 10 games out of our last 19. Especially since most of them are at home.

Errrmmm.....

Please remeber that 12 of those wins have come with "Mr. Coincidence" as the starting PG not Nelson.

Thank You.

Doesn't matter who was starting. My point is that you don't need a great PG to be a 50-win team. You can have other players that are playmakers (Turk). That was my point.

Have you always just been an Arroyo fan? You're obviously not a Magic fan. You really just care about Arroyo. I like how you ignore all the times we've won without Arroyo and then when we win with him playing, you bring it up. And when we lose without him, you come on here and tell us it's because Arroyo didn't play. Typical bias right there. Get over it. Arroyo is a mediocre PG in this league. Nothing special. If you want to believe he is something great, then go right ahead. You're clearly have a bias toward him. I personally don't care if Arroyo or Nelson starts. I just want to see the Magic win, because I'm an actual Magic fan.

BTW, remember that great win we had in Detroit WITHOUT Arroyo? What happened there? Was that just a fluke?
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magiclive
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iceveins333
Mar. 6, 2008 12:25 AM
brutalfacts is right, sure we probably will win 50 games but w/ nelson/arroyo being the starting PG we arent gonna be a serious title contending threat

I agree that we are not a legit title contender. I still think if Dwight keeps developing for a few years and we get a stronger frontcourt to come off the bench, this team can be considered a legit title contender with the PGs we have right now. Look at Boston. Rondo is a middle of the pack PG, yet the Celtics are considered a title contender. Sometimes I think the PG position is overrated. The PG doesn't always need to be the playmaker on the team (Turk is a great example). The Cavs had no great PG last year and they made it to the Finals. That's because LeBron was the playmaker for the team.

BTW, I'm not saying that I think we should leave the PG situation the way it is. I'm not saying that at all. We should upgrade at that position. I was just pointing out examples of how you don't always need a great PG to be a title contender.
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Canes2311
Sixth Man
magiclive
Mar. 6, 2008 12:47 AM
I agree that we are not a legit title contender. I still think if Dwight keeps developing for a few years and we get a stronger frontcourt to come off the bench, this team can be considered a legit title contender with the PGs we have right now. Look at Boston. Rondo is a middle of the pack PG, yet the Celtics are considered a title contender. Sometimes I think the PG position is overrated. The PG doesn't always need to be the playmaker on the team (Turk is a great example). The Cavs had no great PG last year and they made it to the Finals. That's because LeBron was the playmaker for the team.

BTW, I'm not saying that I think we should leave the PG situation the way it is. I'm not saying that at all. We should upgrade at that position. I was just pointing out examples of how you don't always need a great PG to be a title contender.

Rondo would start for us right now no questions asked. I'm sick of waiting we just need to bring decent vet in at pg and get a decent pf to come in and where set for that title run.
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gomagic33
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Mr. Anderson
With the current roster we have, I think we will make it to the 2nd round of the playoffs at least. Then we get cut down...we'll be ranting on Otis again by that time. I am beginning to accept that we are not going to serious contenders this season.

I am "happy" with the progress of this season's team. It's been a long long time since we are made the playoffs with a lot of games left - but we know we are still at least 1 player away from being a serious contender.

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TheFalcon
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Air Gortat
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AND1 shoes? I never would have guessed. :rolleyes:


I'm just poking fun, so please don't get upset. I know we win every game he plays in. ;)
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TheFalcon
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Air Gortat
I swear the ads on the ebay banner are getting weirder by the day.

Right now, mine shows a "Magic Shave Powder Pubic Bikini Leg Hair Removal Kit" (a bargain at $10.98).
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MAGICMANEVAN
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TheFalcon
Mar. 6, 2008 06:57 AM
I swear the ads on the ebay banner are getting weirder by the day.

Right now, mine shows a "Magic Shave Powder Pubic Bikini Leg Hair Removal Kit" (a bargain at $10.98).

:lol:

Yeah they just basically use words from the page your on and find ads "for you". Flawed I know.
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magiclive
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Canes2311
Mar. 6, 2008 12:50 AM
magiclive
Mar. 6, 2008 12:47 AM
I agree that we are not a legit title contender. I still think if Dwight keeps developing for a few years and we get a stronger frontcourt to come off the bench, this team can be considered a legit title contender with the PGs we have right now. Look at Boston. Rondo is a middle of the pack PG, yet the Celtics are considered a title contender. Sometimes I think the PG position is overrated. The PG doesn't always need to be the playmaker on the team (Turk is a great example). The Cavs had no great PG last year and they made it to the Finals. That's because LeBron was the playmaker for the team.

BTW, I'm not saying that I think we should leave the PG situation the way it is. I'm not saying that at all. We should upgrade at that position. I was just pointing out examples of how you don't always need a great PG to be a title contender.

Rondo would start for us right now no questions asked. I'm sick of waiting we just need to bring decent vet in at pg and get a decent pf to come in and where set for that title run.

Still doesn't make Rondo any better of a PG. He is still a middle of the pack PG. It probably doesn't say much for the PGs we have right now.
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Ben Q Rock
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3QC
TheFalcon
Mar. 6, 2008 06:55 AM
Posted Image

AND1 shoes? I never would have guessed. :rolleyes:


I'm just poking fun, so please don't get upset. I know we win every game he plays in. ;)

Nothing wrong with And One shoes, man. Darrell Armstrong used to wear them. Still does, actually. 8-)
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Nogaro
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magiclive
Mar. 6, 2008 12:43 AM
Nogaro
Mar. 5, 2008 11:59 PM
magiclive
Mar. 5, 2008 11:39 PM
If we play .500 ball the rest of the way, this team will have 50 wins. Does anyone else remember the all-knowing Brutalfacts who said this team has no chance of being a 50-win team unless they get new PGs? He said as long as Jameer is the starter, we will never be a 50-win team. I agree that Jameer is probably not the long-term answer, but I'm sure Brutal's starting to get the crow out on the dinner table.

We still have 19 games left. So nothing's certain just yet. But this team is capable of winning 50 games and that alone proves the "really smart guy" on this board wrong. There's no reason why we can't win 10 games out of our last 19. Especially since most of them are at home.

Errrmmm.....

Please remeber that 12 of those wins have come with "Mr. Coincidence" as the starting PG not Nelson.

Thank You.

Doesn't matter who was starting. My point is that you don't need a great PG to be a 50-win team. You can have other players that are playmakers (Turk). That was my point.

Have you always just been an Arroyo fan? You're obviously not a Magic fan. You really just care about Arroyo. I like how you ignore all the times we've won without Arroyo and then when we win with him playing, you bring it up. And when we lose without him, you come on here and tell us it's because Arroyo didn't play. Typical bias right there. Get over it. Arroyo is a mediocre PG in this league. Nothing special. If you want to believe he is something great, then go right ahead. You're clearly have a bias toward him. I personally don't care if Arroyo or Nelson starts. I just want to see the Magic win, because I'm an actual Magic fan.

BTW, remember that great win we had in Detroit WITHOUT Arroyo? What happened there? Was that just a fluke?

Why are you attacking me? I AM a fan of Arroyo.....Adamos likes Gortat.....does that makes us "less" fans of the Magic? I only pointed out that out of those 50 wins Arroyo had started on 12 of those? Is that not true?

I've never said that Arroyo deserves ALL the credit or even MUCH of it. It is you guys that have continously written that I think that Arroyo is something that he is not. All I've ever ask for is the notion that he at least contributes.....that's all. If you or anyone on this site refuse to admit that, then I will continue to point it out...simple. Just like TheFalcon is a fan of Jameer (although he won't admit it publicly) and he points out when Jameer plays good.... and when he plays bad then TheFalcon defends him.

I watch the games (even when Arroyo doesn't play) but choose not to participate in the forum unless I feel like Arroyo is being attacked. If that provokes your rage on me then so be it.

BTW, most people in this forum said that the 2nd Detroit win was a fluke NOT me. So ask them.

Finally, all of you throw around being a Magic Fan not a <insert a players name> fan like it's a badge of honor.....that is so hypocritical! Everyone has a player that they like the most....some of you like Dooling, some of you like Jameer, others love JJ, Diener, Howard and/or Turk....even Pat and Gortat have a special part in the hearts of some. Don't preach to me about being a Magic Fan.....at the end of the day we all have a favorite player and have defended him in this forum.
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Nogaro
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MagicMadness
Mar. 6, 2008 12:25 AM
Not to debate Nogaro, but just pointing out that looking at Ben's stats (thanks for posting those, by the way), the Magic are 28-18 when Nelson starts.

That means they're winning about 61% of the time when Nelson starts - or 50 games out of 82. So technically, magiclive would be right.

However, as has been pointed out numerous times by many of us here, the clubs record has been more a result of our big 3, rather than who starts at PG.

Mmm....Interesting....

So using your same analogy if the Magics are 12-5 when Arroyo starts (about 71%) then the Magics could've won 58 games this season?!?!?!

C'mon that stat is a joke! :lol:

We all know the BIG THREE are the reason we are shooting (no pun intended) for a 50 W season. Just wanted to point out that Nelson was not responsible for running the point in ALL of those 50 wins....that's all.
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Ben Q Rock
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3QC
Quote:
 
I watch the games (even when Arroyo doesn't play) but choose not to participate in the forum unless I feel like Arroyo is being attacked. If that provokes your rage on me then so be it.


Fairly or unfairly, that's what gives some people here the impression that you're an Arroyo fan first and a Magic fan second.

Quote:
 
Finally, all of you throw around being a Magic Fan not a <insert a players name> fan like it's a badge of honor.....that is so hypocritical! Everyone has a player that they like the most....some of you like Dooling, some of you like Jameer, others love JJ, Diener, Howard and/or Turk....even Pat and Gortat have a special part in the hearts of some. Don't preach to me about being a Magic Fan.....at the end of the day we all have a favorite player and have defended him in this forum.


True, we all have favorite players on the Magic. I was pretty upset when we traded Trevor, but that didn't make me, like, quit on the team or anything. There's a notion here that if Arroyo leaves in free-agency (or if we trade him) that some people purporting to be Magic fans will no longer post here and will instead go to the forum of Carlos' next team. In that case, those people were never Magic fans in the first place.
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