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Sooo...did I get this right?; Did I understand these rules correctly?
Topic Started: 29 Apr 2015, 04:55 PM (560 Views)
Azmo

Dear fellow Kill Team leaders,

as some friends and I currently think about reviving some old nostalgic Mortheim feelings but this time in the 40k universe, we thought about playing Herald of Ruins' Kill Team variant. :)
However, while reading the rules and thinking about first lists (and reading some forum threads here), some questions arose, which I hope, are not too stupid to ask or could please verified by you. I took a look through the forum, but didn't find something like this already posted. ;)

Sooo...did I get it right, that...

1.) When buying a model for my list, all wargear options from the original codex are banned? I came upon this as a friend of mine wanted to build a Space Wolf TW Pack Leader with Storm Shield, which is not part of the Kill Team Armoury, but part of the original codex armoury. As opposite point, an Orc list here included a Nob with Power Claw, which is part of the original codex but not mentioned in the Orc KT armoury. So, which is correct? I think, the codex wargear options should be completely ignored and Orc Nobs don't have access to power claws except by taking the Meganob upgrade? Or does the sentence "May take items from the Melee Weapons and Ranged Weapons lists." talking about the codex weapon lists?

2.) When buying squad entries for my list (like Orc Boyz or Gretchin), their total number counts for the maximum total amount of allowed core models.

3.) When playing with the transport rules, it doesn't matter if a transport vehicle is only available as dedicated transport in the original codex. I am allowed to buy it separately without buying the actual unit from the codex (e.g. Devilfish without buying Tau Fire Warriors).

4.) Vehicles (transports + walker) don't need to test for rout or anything else just like in 40k. Or are there rout tests with the given theoretical leadership of 10? Models don't have to test for Pinning when a vehicle model in 3" is destroyed, only when a non-vehicle model is killed.

5.) Vehicles DO count against the number of models when it comes to calculating if I have to take rout tests.

6.) Bikes work like in 40k. So, running does not exist for them, but they move Flat Out during the shooting phase. But they are not affected by their speed like vehicles (only 6", limited pivoting, etc.). They also have to make dangerous terrain tests when moving through difficult terrain but are not slowed down. So as question, can my Orc Bikers move 12" in the movement phase + 12" in the shooting phase like normally? And do all their special rules apply, like getting +1 to jink cover saves after moving flat out?

7.) Generally, all special rules + movement variants of equipment and unit types from the original 40k game also apply for Kill Team games, like Slow & Purposeful for Meganobs or Hammer of Wrath for bikers + jump infantry.

8.) This question is quite heavy power gaming style and cheesy, but I'm interested in it anyway. :P
Can I hide behing my own models? The tactical point would be to build a cordon around a single model with many models. The middle model goes into hiding and thus may not be directly targeted by blasts. However, as normally, blasts have to be centered over a model, the whole cordon is save because the template can never be placed without also touching the middle model, which is hiding.
Hiding behind my own models can also help with Doks and similar combos. My current rules knowledge would allow it but not like it.

I don't think, I'd play this way, but I know some of my gaming partners and better ask before we play and discussions arise and so we can come to terms beforehand. :D


Thanks in advance for your advice and help.

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Narmet

1. I believe that the model entries will say "May take from the Ranged/Special/Heavy/Melee Weapons List" to allow the usual codex options for some models. For instance, the SW TW leader has the SS option from the "Melee Weapons List" in the SW codex, so that's doable.

2. Yep.

3. Good question; I'm not 100% sure but the vehicle rules say "any unit with the Transport type" so the Devilfish sans FW is probably fine.

4. I'd be curious about this too. If all you have left is a "War Walker", say, it has no given leadership value for a Rout Test (which is explicitly not a usual Leadership or Morale test rules-wise). Haven't had this come up yet, though, personally.

5. But yeah, I think they count as a model.

6. Turbo-boost for bikes works normally, I'd say - 12" move + 12" turbo, yep. If you have Skilled Rider that'd work normally; Flat Out isn't a thing for bikes, though.

7. Yep.

8. Hmm. I might let you hide behind friendlies if there was a dense enough cover (at least 50% in the rules), but it also says that hiding models can be "accidentally" hit by blasts, just not targeted directly. So people could still target a model standing just in front of you and catch the cowardly Dok in the blast if it hit.

Enjoy!
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Aphyria
Corporal
Just want to point out something in relation to 8: there is nothing in the Blast rules about having to be 'centred' over a model. The actual rule states, "When firing a Blast weapon, models do not roll To Hit. Instead, just pick one enemy model visible to the firer and place the 3" blast marker with its hole entirely over the base of the target model", and in fact, if you look at the diagram, the hole isn't over the centre of the ork boy, it's more to the top right, but still has the entirety of the hole over the model's base (just not the centre).

Other than that, seems mostly in order. I think that in terms of vehicles for 4, they'll probably follow the bit about never taking leadership tests (which is interesting, since that means they could theoretically never redirect a charge or counter-charge, as they require successful LD checks). If that is the case, it also creates the peculiar situation where, if the vehicle is the last model alive, you can't take a rout check (since they don't take LD checks) for them alone. You probably want to organise with your group about how exactly this is played out (perhaps instead of never taking them, they are instead treated as always passing for purposes of redirecting charges/counter-charges/rout checks for being the last model left).
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Azmo

Thanks for the input so far.

@Narmet: Yeah, Flat Out was the wrong term, of course, I meant Turboboosting. However as moving during the shooting phase was changed for other unit types, I was unsure whether bikes just were lucky. :)

@Aphyria: Right, I confused the part about centering with "having the whole hole over the model". However, when putting all models base to base with the one in the middle hiding, it should still be not possible to place a 3" template over any model without at least touching the center model. However, it's rulesmongering and I am not sure if it deserves too much thinking, but some people play more competitive than others. I this case, I guess, I'd drive/jump within 12", so they can't hide and blast the whole cordon with a template. :D
Or don't allow hiding behind own models at all. Although the picture is nice of an Orc Mek hiding behind it's Kill Kan while tinkering on it. :)

About the vehicle leadership tests, I might just do what you suggested and talk about it when someone uses a vehicle. I think, using Ld 10 seems appropriate.
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Narmet

Azmo
30 Apr 2015, 11:55 AM
Right, I confused the part about centering with "having the whole hole over the model". However, when putting all models base to base with the one in the middle hiding, it should still be not possible to place a 3" template over any model without at least touching the center model. However, it's rulesmongering and I am not sure if it deserves too much thinking, but some people play more competitive than others.
I think the "hiding" model can be legally under the blast without that counting as him being "targeted" by it, just so long as he's not the guy the hole is centered over. So you'd want a screen of guys about 1 1/2" away from him, who still provided enough cover for him to be able to Hide behind. That way even if a blast was centered on one of them, your Hider wouldn't be hit. Unless it scattered unluckily. ;)
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