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New Forthcoming Guard; Inc Valk & stuff from Design Studio Day
Topic Started: 8 Feb 2009, 09:53 PM (28,070 Views)
☺charlie_c67
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highmarshaldave
21 Mar 2009, 11:18 PM
Ah, but what about us grizzled vets who are continually loo'd upon by the company we've suported, and often worked for, for so many years.

Dave out.
Are you talking about unit's changing/disappearing/losing options here Dave? Cos if you are then as far as I can tell there is a reason for it. Part of it is down to trying to boost the appearance/sales of certain units.

For example, the current termi rules are based on changes made by Andy/Jervis (forget which) because people viewed them as underpowered for the points cost with rubbish survivabiity. Others lost things because they were abused by so say powergamers who can ruin the game for others and take it too far as OG described. I understand it's frustrating but I would imagine that you had a fairly balanced army and didn't go into your games with the soul aim of rubbing your opponants face in your victory. Sad to say you get people like that and this may be they only effective way GW can combat it.

As for the minis, I have to say I really don't understand why RT gets such a huge misty eyed following. Yes there are some good models (the thudd gun, the servitors, the land speeder), but equally quality was not as high as it is now, poses were fixed and some representations weren't all that good (mole mortar and upright shoulder heavy weapon marines). Ok, they may be encroaching on FW territory, but then could you not argue that FW is a testing ground in some ways. And where would you take guard from where they were?

Finally, talking about some peoples views (rants) about GW being the evil empire, these are the same people who often go off on one about price hikes (which none of us like) but never take in to account real life ecnomics and such things as inflation. Things like the price of oil being low may mean the petrol prices should be lower than they are, but companies that use oil based products can't adjust their prices as easily. This means things like the high oil prices of recent times would've been sucked up by GW and therefore the times of low oil prices will balance this out.

Gonna stop now before I go further O/T. Feel like I've joined the old fart brigade properly now ;)
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Tinners
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Doesn't it look like a face!
Old Guard
22 Mar 2009, 09:58 PM
People get too serious over this, there was some tool who had a cracking Ork site who has virtually ground to a halt because as he put it 'it's a protest against GW changing the Ork Codex! GET A LIFE!!!!
Don't forget he was going to crush his models with his car because GW changed the rules...and actually made orks better.

Also: Hah, finally you and Lukas agree on something.
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# Old Guard
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Entertainment officer...Meet the gang cos the boys are here.....
Tinners
23 Mar 2009, 01:15 AM


Also: Hah, finally you and Lukas agree on something.
you take that back. Now! .....I mean it thats not funny ;)
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☺highmarshaldave
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Andy: Cheers mate, don't want no grudges being harboured since I actually have to meet you soon enough.

Digits: I think my main problem with the up and coming codex isn't the uber units, the new models or the jumping onto Forge World's bandwagon: its the loss of customisation, the same thing that bugged me about the latest marine codex. Doctrines, and traits, were fairly cool and not exactly game winning; simple enough to understand, for the most part, but involved enough to allow you to put a brand new spin on stuff. But hey, there is nothing to stop you from using the old 'dex in friendly games, is there?

Dave out.
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# Old Guard
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Entertainment officer...Meet the gang cos the boys are here.....
I dont do grudges chap. I just rant and rage until I get to smile again (probably means I'm a basket case but it works for me!)

i see your point however I feel actually quite liberated by what i have seen so far. I hope (if I have interpreted things correctly) that this will allow a wide range of different formations and allows people to create quite fluffy (either official or not) army lists, whether these are competitive is a totally different beast. But i have my eye on a range of forces that i could not have created before.

and yeah in friendly games you can do what you want
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☺highmarshaldave
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But. . . No sharpshooters!?

:'(

Seriously though, I'm gonna reserve judgement 'til release day. I don't deny I am fairly excited by many of the models themselves, but its the rules that are leaving me scratching my napper.

Dave out.
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# Marovian
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Blimey, I go to work for one night shift and everyone falls out over guard!

I'm split on the issue of doctrines. On the one hand I shall miss my sharpshooters and my iron discipline. But I really like the sound of the orders system as it seems more like what the guard should be. I suppose it is progress, and we need that otherwise the game will get very stale.

As for the models, well, I've always been of the opinion GW is way ahead of the curve on quality. Sure we sometimes pay a bit more, but you get a refined system, high quality models and a world wide following. I know GW don't always make the right decisions for my own personal tastes, but hey, I could say that about a lot of things.

And finally, to join in with the debate of moaners, why do people do it. The other site is full of people who moan and moan and moan for no reason. If it's that bad, get out of the hobby! They are my pet hate.

I'm going to stop now, before I start ranting :)
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☺Jasevx
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Techmarine
Yep, nothing worse than a copper who winges! ;)
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Keravin
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Go post in someone's topic that you normally wouldn't
I'm quite happy with the change of doctrines for orders. It certainly seems to be more in line with how the army should work. It also doesn't seem to penalise players with armies already unlike the Marine Codex did.

Then again I'm hoping PP show them how it works to do a new edition and not shaft at least some proportion of your player base.
Edited by Keravin, 23 Mar 2009, 03:46 PM.
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# Marovian
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jasevx
23 Mar 2009, 03:43 PM
Yep, nothing worse than a copper who winges! ;)
As if I would do such a thing.
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Railgunner
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Well it seems my bank has been charged, so fingers crossed my codex will be in the post soon if what the mail order troll said is true :)

RG
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Lycosa Astra
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Railgunner
23 Mar 2009, 04:54 PM
Well it seems my bank has been charged, so fingers crossed my codex will be in the post soon if what the mail order troll said is true :)

RG
Well some people reported getting their pre-orders of Dark Heresy a month early... but I think in this case I'd bet on the mail order troll telling fibs. ;)
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Burnie
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I'm quite a fan of the orders system of rules, don't get me wrong, and I especially appreciate the availability of valks. Just not a fan of the valkyrie being reduced to a skimmer because I always saw the flyer rules as something really fun to throw into the mix.

Not trying to whinge, just stating an appreciation for the old ways as well.

Nonetheless I look forward to the new 'dex wholeheartedly
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Xisor
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Hey folks,

I'll come down opposed to HMD's 'loo'd on by a company' approach and say I've been loosely happy with GW over the years. Bumf like their terrible support of SGs and the removal of my '2 special weapon' Salamanders tactical squads really isn't a terrible issue for me. Faced with Apocalypse, I'm almost content (it plays loosely like Epic, hooray!).

It's always greener on the other side, rose-tinted hindsight etc. Frankly, 5th Ed really is more enjoyable than 3rd Ed. The modern codices might be better, but I'd hedge a bet that Codex creep is nothing more sinister or despicable than economic inflation. I'm not suggesting they're the same, but I imagine there's a vaguely similar mechanic at work.

In that regard, the only major issue I have is with the prices going up. And even then, it's only really a mindless grumble. Things were cheaper in my day, y'see. Twelve British pounds (sterling!) for a full tactical squad, dontcha know!?

Hoho. No, all this newfangled IG stuff looks terrific. I'm quite keen to get my grubby mits on some of it. I'd certainly be willing to believe they might creep too far with a Codex in one go (i.e. make it too powerful), but I'll reserve judgment and instead take it as given that things were a bit unbalanced anyway.

Also: being able to win =/= not underpowered. But that's just pedantry picking apart your silly logic!
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Gallows Bait
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Thing that also crosses my mind is that GW is also a pretty sensible business, and one that is very seriously trying to look at reducing costs. (See cut backs on bitz ordering, WD studios and so forth). This is because if you look at their recent accounts, they've taken a hammering, they've been losing money. They're turning it around, but all the same, not fun times at GW HQ i'm sure.

So for me, when I look at it like that, I can see they'd be looking at the top sellers over in the FW camp (just a division of GW after all, not a separate company) and if they can churn some of those out in plastic, well it saves a ton on design costs and they can see how well they do with the general (ie non-FW) customers.

Judging by the number of superheavies being built and painted here, its a successful formula.

If I wanted to pick a means of showing their disregard for older gamers for the sake of profit though, I'd look at the woeful state of the Specialist games, I really do miss so many of those models - but they weren't big enough sellers as gamers moved to smaller gang based games as they moved through the hobby.

Also, yeah, nearly a decade on I'm STILL bearing a grudge over their cancelling of the Fanatic magazine after only 10 issues (and having to struggle to get my remaining sub refunded) - it totally killed my enthusiasm, and at the time I was buying all their publications, playing Inquisitor, BFG, Bloodbowl and Necromunda, my spending dried up very quickly.
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# the_great_gonzo
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personally I don't care if the new IG codex plays like a 26stone stripper ripped on rohypnol, I am a IG fanboy through and through, I've collected since the RT era metal minis, through the 30 man plastic boxset with lascannons (oh and a couple of squat boxsets too!) right through to metal vallhallans, Plastic cadians, DKOK and now back to plastic cadians. I am happy to throw my money at GW so long as they provide me an unending supply of plastic gaming porn I have no intention of ever painting! roll on may's "Gonzo's amazing undercoated only flying circus". and tank-mageddon! WootWoot!
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☺Jasevx
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So your colour scheme will be black?
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Heathgrove
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Night fighting specialists... They only attack during night and so everyone is black because it is so dark?
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fiendil
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the_great_gonzo
25 Mar 2009, 10:23 AM
personally I don't care if the new IG codex plays like a 26stone stripper ripped on rohypnol
That would be awesome. How hard do you think it would be to stop a 26 stone stripper doing exactly what he/she/it liked?
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☺Jasevx
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Techmarine
You could ask my ex-wife....
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