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Atheism
Topic Started: Feb 6 2008, 09:46 PM (3,225 Views)
Bunni Killer
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It's one thing to be agnostic or indifferent. Atheism, though--the vehement, absolute certainty that there is no god of any sort--is unreasonable in and of itself. Instead, it's usually a reaction.

People look at religions and are threatened or put out, so in rebellion they decide there cannot be a god. A scientist like Dawkins may see fundamentalist religion as unreasonable and dangerous to modern thought--so he overreacts and denies any possiblity of a God. Or someone sees something bad done in the Church's name, and decides that because part of it is wrong, it is wrong, and because it is wrong, God doesn't exist.

Or else people see suffering and decide that a loving God like the Christian one could not exist and therefore no god can exist. It is a very narrow view.

Obviously the logic is flawed. A bad church doesn't disprove god any more than a good church proves it. In order to have any definite opinion of God, you have to use faith instead of logic.

By claiming absolute certainty that God cannot exist, people make atheism their religion--and in the fervor to convince others they are right, they begin converting in its name.

It's a lot like racism; when someone is threatened, they tend to polarize. It's so much easier that way.
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Mr Master52
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Before I accepted Jesus Christ in my heart it was so much easier not to, to become and atheist and don't care about the world. But after I did it, it was so much better.
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Blackt3ars
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Meh, I don't like people who brag about stuff. Including religion.
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Yowming41
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What do you mean by "brag"? I've never met anyone who said "Ha, I'm a Christian and you're not, you loser."
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Yowming41
Sep 30 2008, 02:14 AM
Well, I...can't really help you there, L337. I think that the main reason that atheists are atheists, no matter whether they have good proof or bad proof, is because the alternative (believing, and thus serving and being judged by God) is unthinkable to them. It's like getting rid of their 'freedom'. They couldn't control their own lives, or decide what's 'right' for them (Yes, if you think about it I could shoot everyone and it'd be fine since animals kill each other, and we're just like them, aren't we? We shouldn't need standards. If God doesn't decide what's right for me, I think -I- will.)
Not true, animals kill each other for reasons. Is the lion evil because it kills another baby animal to eat, no it is not. Am I evil if I kill a kid from my school just because something he said pissed me off... maybe.

I don't need the fear of burning in hell to keep me in line; I don't need a lord to inspire me or keep me strong. If you think I do tell me why.

I don't want to accept a god because I don't think somthing like that exists, and even if it did I wouldn't give myself up to it. You know once in a servay 50 severly ill people (all the same desease) where told they where being prayed for, 50 where told nothing; those told they where being prayed for had a higher death rate and recovered more slowly. This proves little becuase no people are equal in the ability to recover/survive but think on this for a bit.
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Mr Master52
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We are not animals. We are not animals. Please read those other sentences to understand why I think we are different from animals.
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Pad Box
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We could consider ourselves different from animals because we kill eachother over nothing and desecrate the planet, those don't seem to be things animals do. If anything they are better than us.
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1337 Sk1llzz
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Pad, could an animal discover the theory of relativity, build an empire, or even tie a shoe? No, they can't do anyone these things. It's takes them months of training just to learn not to go to the bathroom in the house. It's pretty obvious we are better, and the most developed species on the planet.
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Bunni Killer
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1337 Sk1llzz
Oct 10 2008, 12:22 AM
Pad, could an animal discover the theory of relativity, build an empire, or even tie a shoe? No, they can't do anyone these things. It's takes them months of training just to learn not to go to the bathroom in the house. It's pretty obvious we are better, and the most developed species on the planet.
Yes, an animal could--specifically, the homo sapien.

We share all the characteristics that qualify a species as a member of the kindgom Animalia. Our unique characteristics don't change that fact--they just make us part of a distinct species.

To say that our superior mental capacity stops us from being animals is like saying that a koala is not an animal because other animals don't eat eucalyptus leaves.

A kingdom is an extremely broad range; Animalia includes anything from sponges to insects to lions to--it must be said--humans.

Now, if you want to believe that man also has something distinct--spiritually, mentally, Made in God's Image--that's fine. But it doesn't change the fact that we belong to the Kingdom Animalia. That honestly isn't any more demeaning to us than the fact that we share the same air as other animals and bleed the same blood as other mammals.
Edited by Bunni Killer, Oct 10 2008, 04:22 AM.
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Mr Master52
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Here we go with the religious debate again...oh wait, this is an atheism topic, lol.
Well, I can assure you 99% of the atheists only follow 4/10 out of the commandments and even the best Christian only follow 7/10. As it is written in the bible, no one is perfect. Everybody has lied, many of us have stolen something, even if it was for fun, and who hasn't killed an insect or an ant? So, that means that
4/10 = 40%, and that's an Epic Ph4ilure
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Mr Master52
Oct 13 2008, 04:06 PM
Here we go with the religious debate again...oh wait, this is an atheism topic, lol.
Well, I can assure you 99% of the atheists only follow 4/10 out of the commandments and even the best Christian only follow 7/10. As it is written in the bible, no one is perfect. Everybody has lied, many of us have stolen something, even if it was for fun, and who hasn't killed an insect or an ant? So, that means that
4/10 = 40%, and that's an Epic Ph4ilure
Many of the comandments are god related so an atheist would most likely only follow a few. Lets examin the list shall we?

1- Have no other gods.
Well atheists would most definitly follow this: so far christian 1/10 atheist 0/10

2- Do not make idols
This tells people people to follow and bow down to no one but god, this is once again regected by the atheist: now christian 2/10 atheist 0/10

3- Do not take the lords name in vane
Lol i don't think anyone follows this to the day they die: christian 2/10 atheist 0/10

4- Keep the sabbath day
A day of rest is recognised by most all people, regardless if it is because god rested the seventh day or not: christian 3/10 atheist 1/10

5- Honor your parents
This is done by most all even if kids seem to rebel: christian 4/10 atheist 2/10

6- Thou shall not kill
This interprets directly to do not murder, even though it seems to happen often most people will never kill another human in their lifetime: christian 5/10 atheist 3/10

7- Do not commit adultery
this really isn't done very often by anyone: christian 6/10 atheist 4/10

8- Do not steal
Everyone steals somthing in their lifetime even if you don't mean to: christian 6/10 atheist 4/10

9- Do not falsly accuse
Everyone will do this in their lifetime, self preservation is natural: christian 6/10 atheist 4/10

10- Do not covet
Perhapse a man shown this by his religon might follow this, atheists may not: christian 7/10 atheist 4/10

Yep you were right about those numbers, however this shows atheists are not bad because they only follow around 4 comandments. It is simply that many involve following god which is the very oposite of athiesem. WE ARE NOT BAD PEOPLE.

Everyone has morals, ours just omit god
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Yowming41
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You're not bad. Fair enough. But what do you mean by bad? Do you mean what God said was right or wrong, or what everyone basically thinks? I know it seems natural to think that everyone accepts a basis of what is 'good' and 'evil', but that's practically VOTING on it. If everyone decided that killing people is a good thing, what would hold us back from having either 1 or 0 people left on the planet? Even if 'most' people accept things as good and evil and that's how society works, it still shows that if you take God out of the picture, you are left with the common consent of the people in order to establish an idea like that, and as we know people's opinions are not always good, and can easily change.
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Danielle
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I dont realy believe in "god the powerful" but i do believe there are some things in each religion that should be listened to.. lik you shall not kill
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Master was trying to say Athiests only following 4 comandments was bad, I was showing why it wasn't.
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Saj_61
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All I can say is, rules are made to be broken
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Joe
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They're no so much rules though, guidelines is a better word.
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Jack Sam1
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Mr Master52
Oct 13 2008, 04:06 PM
Well, I can assure you 99% of the atheists only follow 4/10 out of the commandments and even the best Christian only follow 7/10. As it is written in the bible, no one is perfect. Everybody has lied, many of us have stolen something, even if it was for fun, and who hasn't killed an insect or an ant? So, that means that
4/10 = 40%, and that's an Epic Ph4ilure
You always do this in debates...you throw up arguements that have no solidarity to it. Do you have a poll of results that follow this? If you do, I don't see it here...and anyway..that's impossible to solve.

Also, you come to conclusions..again without basis. How do you know everybody had lied? How do you know if everyone has stolem something? We may have killed them, but you fail to mention accidentally.

Also....you say 40% is `Epic Failure`...in Chemistry, 40% yield is very good.

Please...I've told you enough in the past. Don't just mention randomly generated facts...and with such exaggeration. God.
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To be honest jack I looked at what he said and it was true, however there was no "failure" about it. It was just a useless fact that might affect people who don't care to look into it.
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Blackt3ars
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The fact is, he didn't give any sources. The way he said it made it sounds as if all those numbers were rough estimations. And then he also claimed he was 99% sure those numbers were correct. I hope you don't do that when you are writing an essay at a universitary level, probably every professor would give you a 1. Basing things on rough estimations is wrong, even when you're discussing religion.

Edit: Small note to Jack: I believe a 1 is similar to an F. Not sure though. We work with a decimal system. 1 being the lowest, 10 the highest.
Edited by Blackt3ars, Oct 22 2008, 02:17 PM.
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Jack Sam1
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Yes, that is correct Black. Even though it sounds like I was whinging, I was also doing it for the benefit for him. I provide facts which have sources and backing behind them, as, like you said, you need to at University. I'm guessing a 1 is bad at Dutch Universitys?

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Also: `Universitary`. Classic ;)

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Anyway, shall we get back on topic?
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