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Eli, we believed in you! What happened?
Topic Started: Jan 11 2009, 08:53 PM (193 Views)
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by Jim Baumbach, Newsday

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You think you know someone, and then ... poof.

Eli Manning, why tease Giants fans like this?

You had them believing you were The Man for what you did in last year's Super Bowl. And, no, one bad loss won't change that. They'll always love you for that memory.

But that's in the past, and Giants fans right now care about this year. And on Sunday, you stunk.

You're not the sole reason why the Giants' season ended with an ugly 23-11 loss to the Eagles. Everyone realizes that. But you definitely were one of the main reasons. And because of that, because of your poor play, it's only human nature for that question to rear its ugly head again.

Who exactly is the real Eli Manning?

Is he the guy who was so cool under pressure in the 2007 postseason, the guy who led the Giants down the field in Arizona to beat the unbeatable New England Patriots a year ago?

Or is he the guy who always seems to be throwing floppy passes off his back foot and getting intercepted far too often?

That's who he was from 2004 through the 2007 regular season. And that's who he was Sunday.

And to think Manning had come so far, right? Or had he? That's what we don't know right now.

In the wake of the Super Bowl, Manning looked so good during the regular season. He was always playing under control, throwing the ball away instead of making clumsy passes. He cut his interceptions in half. And remember those passes that used to get stuck in the wind? They had such zip this season.

It was so easy to say he had arrived. In many ways, he had. But if that's the case, then on Sunday, he disappeared. Now Giants fans don't know what to think, and you can't blame them.

Off this loss, the Giants can only hope the good, efficient Eli -- not the Eli we saw against the Eagles -- shows up at training camp in Albany next summer.

We realize it was windy out there. That had to be a factor. But this is Giants Stadium in the winter. It's always going to be windy here. The quarterbacks who succeed here are the ones who learn to play in the wind at Giants Stadium. And as good as Manning was in the postseason last season, it's noteworthy that every game was played someplace other than the Meadowlands.
Besides, the Eagles' Donovan McNabb didn't have a great game against the Giants, but when he needed to make plays to get his team down the field, he did. Despite the wind, of course.

If you're looking for a real reason why Manning stunk, perhaps we should start with the absence of Plaxico Burress. Although Burress wasn't having his best year before he shot himself in the leg at a nightclub and the team told him to stay home for the rest of the season, he still drew attention. All those double-teams he received earlier this season made it easier for Manning to look elsewhere.

Not that the Giants saw it that way, or admitted to seeing it that way. "I don't think it has a whole to do with that," coach Tom Coughlin said.

When Manning was asked how the absence of Burress affected his play, he dodged the question. "We just didn't play well today," he said. "It's not about Plaxico. We had opportunities. We have players that can make plays and do things. It's not the issue."

A year ago the Giants were sure their quarterback had turned a corner for good. Based on what we saw against the Eagles, who knows? Better check back in a year.
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OPENING DAY IS COMING!!

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Newsday went nuts on the coverage of this game. They've got like 200 articles, columns and features. This team ain't worth it.

I'm gonna post some sh*t I just wrote in an e-mail which sums up some of my thoughts.

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You know what's going to hurt this offseason? Eli's got one year, $8.95 million left on his contract. Which means that in all likelihood, he's going to be re-signed before the start of next season. And the going rate for upper echelon quarterbacks is around $100 million. It's going to be a rotten afternoon in March when you read on the ESPN ticker: "Chris Mortensen reports that Giants and QB Eli Manning reached agreement on 8-year, $106 million extension." That would be less than what Roethlisberger got, so you know his agent will play that angle. We'll see him get that, knowing his last performance before signing it will have been this one, with a 40.7 quarterback rating. With a bunch of passes that flopped more than your grandmother's titties and wobbled like a retarded, bow-legged kid. It'll be the figurative twisting of the dagger to know that Eli, in all his doofiness, will be among the five highest paid players in the NFL. That, plus the re-signing of Brandon Jacobs, Corey Webster's cap figure (he'll make $9 million in 2009, thanks to the extension) and the expected release of Burress, which would be roughly a $4.25 million cap hit and the Giants won't have enough cap room left to make a big splash in free agency. All these people saying, "We'll be back stronger next year. We can trade for Anquan Boldin." Boldin wants $10 million/year, like Fitzgerald is getting. Hell, the Giants will have to release some people just to create enough space to re-sign Jacobs or Ward.

And it's out of the question that they'd not re-sign Eli to save money. He's still got the cachet of Super Bowl 42 and he's been guilded. Then he followed that up by having a solid, though not special, season. He was only 14th in rating this season, but he cut his interceptions in half from last year and didn't suck, so he gets points for that. And the Giants don't have options. They haven't been grooming anyone behind him and good quarterbacks are like ace pitchers these days - they're getting locked up well before free agency. sh*t, the Packers re-signed Rodgers to $65M in October, after what, like seven good performances. The last good quarterback to hit the market was Drew Brees, and the only reason was because of the Philip Rivers situation. So the Giants will settle and marry a quarterback they're lukewarm on. "Hey, well, ya know, she's... I think she'll make a good mother. She seems motherly. Right? I like h... umm, well, the kids will be nurtured."

Eli can't do anything special. He's not mobile and he has no standout physical skills. It's rare that you think, "Man! How did Eli fit the ball in there? And look'a that one! He showed off the cannon right there." He's not accurate and his arm is just a little above average. And the average+ is almost nullified by the fact that he can't throw a tight spiral so his balls flutter when it's windy. He doesn't have superstar potential, nor does he have the ability to lift a team. He's built to be a game-manager. That's what he was finally able to do this year (instead of being a game-f*cker-upper). He went over 300 yards just once - and it was the first time in two years - and his job was just to not mess things up for everybody and let the running game dominate. The play against New England subtracted, that's just what he did in the playoffs. He tops out at solid. When things are all messy, he's not the one who can clean it up. He'll be right in there with the mess. But the Giants will settle for that. And, because of the championship and Super Bowl MVP on his resume, they'll wind up paying a solid like an elite.

The one thing I can hold onto is that Jerry Reese is cold and shrewd. If ownership doesn't get involved, I could see Reese holding off on the extension and letting him play through 2009. If he does well, they could franchise him. In fact, with the money pinch they'll be in this offseason, it's probably the smarter thing to do. Maybe I should be more optimistic about that happening and not think that the front office will operate like it did with No-Need-for-a-Necklace-Because-He's-Neckless Accorsi.

To answer your question about who'd have been the better fit for this team: I still think Roethlisberger and Rivers would've been better.

- Big Ben, because except for 2006 and sort of this year, has been great at limiting interceptions. He's a game-manager who has the talent to also make big plays and lift the team. Look at what he did last season with a shitty offensive line and no running game. You make Eli work behind what Roethlisberger had last year and he'd have had Joe Namath-like numbers. You put Ben on this team, with a great running game and arguably the best offensive line in the league and his holding of the ball is less of a problem here. Eli doesn't get sacked or hit that often and you have to think those numbers would be even lower if it was a more mobile quarterback or one who could break out of some tackles. Plus Ben's got a stronger, more accurate arm and plays in worse field conditions in Heinz Field than Eli does here. There's the wind here, but they deal with much more precipitation and the field itself is crap.

- Rivers doesn't have a big arm, a lot of credit has to go to the Chargers receivers for creating a lot of separation this year, and some of those balls he shot puts (he's got the weirdest delivery) and hangs in the air would cost him here, but he throws a tight spiral and he's accurate. More than you can say for Eli. Even when Eli's going good, he throws a lot of wobblers and off-target balls. How many times have you seen an Eli pass that was completed and said, "That's a f*cking touchdown if it didn't wobble"? If the task of Giants quarterback, given the current construction of the team, is to manage games, limit turnovers and keep the chains moving, Rivers could do that. I also like his fiery personality, his grit (it's an overused word in sports, especially as it relates to quarterbacks, but it's applicable to a QB who plays with a torn ACL) and his ability to uplift a team. sh*t defense, no running game and Rivers kept them in most games this season - before they started winning. Eli doesn't do that. He goes with the flow. If sh*t is falling apart around him, he falls with it. Even in this game, against the league's best defense when his own defense allowed 35 points and when the team rushed for 15 total yards, Rivers had 308 yards and 3 TDs and outplayed Roethlisberger. In Pittsburgh. And, though I don't want to make it the key to my argument, the stats must be used: Do you expect Eli, regardless of the circumstances, to ever have a season where he throws for 4,000 yards, leads the league in touchdowns and QB rating and has a +23 TD:INT ratio? Eli's best season (this one) is most comparable to Rivers' first season as starter when he had something like 3,300 yards, 22 TDs and 9 INTs. And most of those interceptions came in his last couple games that year.

And it's not the frustration from this game talking. You know what I've thought of Eli. sh*t, a minute after Brady's fourth-down pass went incomplete in the Super Bowl, the first person I called asked, "Do you still hate Eli?" And I said, "I'm not hating right now, but I'd trade his ass for Philip Rivers tonight."

You know what else pissed me off? Not McNabb picking up the phone on the Giants sideline, but Brian Dawkins crying after the game. Overcome with emotion. Tears of joy. The audacity! How dare he pull that sh*t? The man deserves to be paralyzed. Crippled - worthless to his wife and unable to play with his children. He deserves that. After 13 years of dirty play and cheap shots, this asshole has the nerve to shed tears after a win. <sniffles, sniffles> "I went through a lot early in the year." No, the family whose house burned down has gone through a lot early in the year. You went through a 5-5-1 start, which doesn't even matter now since you're headed to another NFC Championship game. Shut the f*ck up. I hope the team plane crashes and everyone escapes unscathed, except Dawkins, whose legs get caught under the seat in front of him and torn from his body on impact.


Rob being a ****** also pissed me off.
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You know, if I were a Giants fan, I'd be close to wanting Eli out of town. If Tyree doesn't make that circus catch with Rodney Harrison doing everything to him but driving his knee into his balls or if Asante Samuel doesn't drop a ball that hit him in the hands... no Super Bowl win for the Giants.
Edited by Yanksfan03, Jan 12 2009, 05:40 AM.
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That's a lot of ifs there, YF. :gaysmile:
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I'd take out the Tyree play as an "if" because that was on third down. They'd have gone for it and 4th & 4 isn't daunting. But, yes, if Asante Samuel does come down with that pick, how much does the perception of him change?
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I still think Asante would've landed out of bounds.
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Yanksfan03
Jan 12 2009, 04:11 AM
You know, if I were a Giants fan, I'd be close to wanting Eli out of town. If Tyree doesn't make that circus catch with Rodney Harrison doing everything to him but driving his knee into his balls or if Asante Samuel doesn't drop a ball that hit him in the hands... no Super Bowl win for the Giants.
The Tyree play was on 3rd and only 4. We still had 4th down, so it's not like the game would have ended had he not made that catch. And the non-interception is garbage, his left foot landed out of bounds anyway. And it's not like the ball was at his chest. The ball was so high, he leaped 73 feet in the air, like only a spook can, and the ball hit his fingertips.



That wasn't a blown play by him, it would of been a miracle for him to catch that ball and an all-time Super Bowl play.


The Giants won that Super Bowl fair and square. Eli deserved the MVP for how he drove the team down the field with a Super Bowl on the line and for how he played in the playoffs. Don't try and take that away from him now, like a true jealous Juets fan, because he went back to being the pussy he always was.

Eli is what he is. A decent QB who can be very good if he has weapons and he gets on a hot streak.
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If I had to choose between Rivers, Big Ben and Eli, I choose Eli third. I'm just not high on the guy. Granted, he had a good postseason last year, he won a Super Bowl, and you can never take that away from him. I'm just not sure he's that great of a QB. He's okay, I think he's pretty cool in the two minute offense and that is a great trait for a QB obviously, but he just doesn't blow me away at all. I mean Jake Delhomme almost won a Super Bowl, in fact he played GREAT in that game. If he won it, can we put him in elite category? Of course not, now that's a big if, and Eli did win, but Eli is not an elite QB. Solid, yes, but he has too many games too often like you saw Sunday.
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Oh yeah, as far as Samuel's feet coming down in bounds or not, I don't think we can say one way or the other what happens if he grabs it. You see him look back as that ball goes through his hands and it kind of takes him back more to the sideline. It's impossible to no either way, but it would have been a hell of a play far from routine for him to catch it and get down in bounds. Great Super Bowl and I was rooting for the Giants so don't call me a jealous Juets fan Roberto!!!!!! I love being a lovable loser in one sport. :bag:
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I was rooting for Eli to win that game too, and I'm not a jealous hater. I really don't give a damn about anything other than the fact that my team sucks and has no direction.
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Jan 13 2009, 08:14 PM
I was rooting for Eli to win that game too, and I'm not a jealous hater. I really don't give a damn about anything other than the fact that my team sucks and has no direction.
Agreed, and to add to that I hate the Muets more then the Giants and I'm certainly not a jealous Muet hater! :bc:
Edited by Grandy4MVP, Jan 14 2009, 05:31 PM.
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