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Do We Have What It Takes To Trade For This Guy..
Topic Started: May 7 2006, 11:52 PM (207 Views)
PavanosBalls
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When right, I like him better than any power pitcher in the league. I'd trust him. Last year, there were rumblings, but San Fran wasn't far enough out to give up on the guy. This season, now while the division still stinks, teams like Colorado and LA should make it hard for the Giants if they are out a bunch of games in July. Is it possible to get this guy without giving up Hughes? Because if so, I make this happen. This is the type of guy we need; someone for post-season that has that 7 IP, 1 Run in their system. He's also capable enough to give 6 IP, 3 run when off his game and not be total BP like guys we got when off.
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Mattingly23
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I wouldn't give up much for a guy who has shown signs of breaking down already. It's just too bad the Yanks didn't seal the deal for him when they ended up with Hitchcock Part II instead.
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PavanosBalls
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He'd have never been fixed. Benito Santiago is a big reason for why he turned it around
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Mattingly23
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Yeah, plus you have to factor in the usual transition to the AL effects. I think he would have been a nice inning eating #3 at the least though.
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PavanosBalls
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Are you still a proponent of Kaat's "Throw the radar gun out of the window" Since Schmidt's a perfect example of why that mindset is total bullshit. He's lost a few MPH on his fastball and he's not as dominant. Hes no different otherwise
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Mattingly23
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I'm not big on exact miles per hour on the guns and comparing them start to start just because certain guns give different readings. I could see a network or stadium upping the results of a pitcher's fastballs, or the guns aren't accurately calibrated often enough. Lost velocity is a problem, but I don't get worked up over a mile per hour here or there. As long as the difference between the cheese and the offspeed stuff is large enough, I don't get overly concerned. What are Schmidt's average readings coming in at these days? Is the gap small? I don't think I have watched more than an inning or two of any of his starts this year.
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PavanosBalls
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No other opinions on Schmidt? I honestly believe we'll be hearing his name in trade discussions in July, especially with San Francisco hobbed by injuries and that division containing too many around .500 teams for them to stay in it til the end if they don't make a surge soon. I mean, would you rather be 6 games behind in 2nd place or 5 games behind in 4th place? Too many obstacles to overcome in that division if you're not good enough
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Grandy4MVP
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I think you can throw the radar gun out with some guys and with others it doesn't really matter. Look at Pedro, he dropped in velocity yet is as nasty as ever!!!! The guy can change speeds and locate his pitches with pinpoint accuracy, same goes for what we've seen from Mussina this year. Location...Location...Location, the guys who have that don't need the extra MPH's. Then there are guys who have lost velocity and strugled. Look at Unit, look at Schilling last year when he didn't have the same zip, it all depends really.

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PavanosBalls
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VarsityVin
May 8 2006, 11:59 AM
I think you can throw the radar gun out with some guys and with others it doesn't really matter.  Look at Pedro, he dropped in velocity yet is as nasty as ever!!!!  The guy can change speeds and locate his pitches with pinpoint accuracy, same goes for what we've seen from Mussina this year.  Location...Location...Location, the guys who have that don't need the extra MPH's.  Then there are guys who have lost velocity and strugled.  Look at Unit, look at Schilling last year when he didn't have the same zip, it all depends really.

I think you're right, but I'd just say that EVERYBODY can use the extra velocity. That change in speeds sh*t that Kay is selling is important, but it wouldn't mean sh*t if Mussina's fastball didn't have that extra pop and location. You got to remember though, when I say velocity, I'm referring to effective velocity. A guy like Kirk Reuter will throw 87 and suck, since his fastball only moved in the low 80s. Some people's pitches straighten out at higher velocity, but the ones that lose velocity and falter are the ones that were effective at the higher speeds. Jaret Wright is one of the few examples of a guy that needed to lose the fastball to gain movement.

And I think Kaat's a dope, since very few people have Greg Maddux like movement and location. He sells that radar gun reading don't mean anything as a way of saying movement and location can get outs. No sh*t, but a lot of power pitchers rely on going right at you, and batters have to respect that fastball more, so the offspeed is automatically more effective. You lose that velocity, you get hurt. Common sense. He doesn't do a good job
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PavanosBalls
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Vin, if Moose and Pedro were throwing 100 MPH, they have ERAs in the 1.00s and 0.00s now. Velocity combined with movement and location is the ultimate
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YankeeBaseball
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PavanosBalls
May 8 2006, 01:01 PM
VarsityVin
May 8 2006, 11:59 AM
I think you can throw the radar gun out with some guys and with others it doesn't really matter.  Look at Pedro, he dropped in velocity yet is as nasty as ever!!!!  The guy can change speeds and locate his pitches with pinpoint accuracy, same goes for what we've seen from Mussina this year.  Location...Location...Location, the guys who have that don't need the extra MPH's.  Then there are guys who have lost velocity and strugled.  Look at Unit, look at Schilling last year when he didn't have the same zip, it all depends really.

I think you're right, but I'd just say that EVERYBODY can use the extra velocity. That change in speeds sh*t that Kay is selling is important, but it wouldn't mean sh*t if Mussina's fastball didn't have that extra pop and location. You got to remember though, when I say velocity, I'm referring to effective velocity. A guy like Kirk Reuter will throw 87 and suck, since his fastball only moved in the low 80s. Some people's pitches straighten out at higher velocity, but the ones that lose velocity and falter are the ones that were effective at the higher speeds. Jaret Wright is one of the few examples of a guy that needed to lose the fastball to gain movement.

And I think Kaat's a dope, since very few people have Greg Maddux like movement and location. He sells that radar gun reading don't mean anything as a way of saying movement and location can get outs. No sh*t, but a lot of power pitchers rely on going right at you, and batters have to respect that fastball more, so the offspeed is automatically more effective. You lose that velocity, you get hurt. Common sense. He doesn't do a good job

Speaking of Maddux, word on the street is that if the Cubs continue to flounder, he will prolly become available, and if he does, the Yankees are one of the teams who are potentially interested. :shocked:
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Grandy4MVP
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PavanosBalls
May 8 2006, 01:01 PM
VarsityVin
May 8 2006, 11:59 AM
I think you can throw the radar gun out with some guys and with others it doesn't really matter.  Look at Pedro, he dropped in velocity yet is as nasty as ever!!!!  The guy can change speeds and locate his pitches with pinpoint accuracy, same goes for what we've seen from Mussina this year.  Location...Location...Location, the guys who have that don't need the extra MPH's.  Then there are guys who have lost velocity and strugled.  Look at Unit, look at Schilling last year when he didn't have the same zip, it all depends really.

I think you're right, but I'd just say that EVERYBODY can use the extra velocity. That change in speeds sh*t that Kay is selling is important, but it wouldn't mean sh*t if Mussina's fastball didn't have that extra pop and location. You got to remember though, when I say velocity, I'm referring to effective velocity. A guy like Kirk Reuter will throw 87 and suck, since his fastball only moved in the low 80s. Some people's pitches straighten out at higher velocity, but the ones that lose velocity and falter are the ones that were effective at the higher speeds. Jaret Wright is one of the few examples of a guy that needed to lose the fastball to gain movement.

And I think Kaat's a dope, since very few people have Greg Maddux like movement and location. He sells that radar gun reading don't mean anything as a way of saying movement and location can get outs. No sh*t, but a lot of power pitchers rely on going right at you, and batters have to respect that fastball more, so the offspeed is automatically more effective. You lose that velocity, you get hurt. Common sense. He doesn't do a good job

It just isn't a given that if you have gas you will succeed. Look at Jorge Julio and Scott Proctor. Proctor has turned it around with developing some good off speed pitches.

I agree with you though, some extra gas will help, it's stupid to say the radar gun doesn't mean anything because it does.
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Mattingly23
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May 8 2006, 01:58 PM

Speaking of Maddux, word on the street is that if the Cubs continue to flounder, he will prolly become available, and if he does, the Yankees are one of the teams who are potentially interested. :shocked:

I think Ed Whitson has a better chance of starting the Yankees' home playoff opener than Maddux ending up in pinstripes.
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Mantlemurcer
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Mattingly23
May 8 2006, 02:34 PM
YankeeBaseball
May 8 2006, 01:58 PM

Speaking of Maddux, word on the street is that if the Cubs continue to flounder, he will prolly become available, and if he does, the Yankees are one of the teams who are potentially interested.  :shocked:

I think Ed Whitson has a better chance of starting the Yankees' home playoff opener than Maddux ending up in pinstripes.

Yeah, I don't see Maddux ever ending up here.
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PavanosBalls
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VarsityVin
May 8 2006, 01:30 PM
PavanosBalls
May 8 2006, 01:01 PM
VarsityVin
May 8 2006, 11:59 AM
I think you can throw the radar gun out with some guys and with others it doesn't really matter.  Look at Pedro, he dropped in velocity yet is as nasty as ever!!!!  The guy can change speeds and locate his pitches with pinpoint accuracy, same goes for what we've seen from Mussina this year.  Location...Location...Location, the guys who have that don't need the extra MPH's.  Then there are guys who have lost velocity and strugled.  Look at Unit, look at Schilling last year when he didn't have the same zip, it all depends really.

I think you're right, but I'd just say that EVERYBODY can use the extra velocity. That change in speeds sh*t that Kay is selling is important, but it wouldn't mean sh*t if Mussina's fastball didn't have that extra pop and location. You got to remember though, when I say velocity, I'm referring to effective velocity. A guy like Kirk Reuter will throw 87 and suck, since his fastball only moved in the low 80s. Some people's pitches straighten out at higher velocity, but the ones that lose velocity and falter are the ones that were effective at the higher speeds. Jaret Wright is one of the few examples of a guy that needed to lose the fastball to gain movement.

And I think Kaat's a dope, since very few people have Greg Maddux like movement and location. He sells that radar gun reading don't mean anything as a way of saying movement and location can get outs. No sh*t, but a lot of power pitchers rely on going right at you, and batters have to respect that fastball more, so the offspeed is automatically more effective. You lose that velocity, you get hurt. Common sense. He doesn't do a good job

It just isn't a given that if you have gas you will succeed. Look at Jorge Julio and Scott Proctor. Proctor has turned it around with developing some good off speed pitches.

I agree with you though, some extra gas will help, it's stupid to say the radar gun doesn't mean anything because it does.

But those guys wouldn't even have careers without their kind of heat.

We were close to Maddux a few seasons ago in the off-season. It wouldn't shock me, although I see the Cubs as buyers and not sellers. The injury bug is putting them out of it early so far though, so who knows. Wrong division to start slow
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Mattingly23
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Maddux was never coming here. The closest he got was when he and Bonds both used the Yankees to drive up their prices before the 1993 season. He was never seriously thinking of coming here when he went back to Chicago three offseasons ago either. Maddux just isn't a New York kind of guy, and if he was going to try it out, it would have been in his prime when he went to Atlanta instead.
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PavanosBalls
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It doesn't matter. Maddux wouldn't put us over the top
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moomoo24
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I'd take Schmidt. Like Matty said he'd be a solid inning eater middle of the rotation guy with on occassion the ability to shut down a good team. Guys like him and what Andy Pettite is closer to now are probably the right kind of guy to go after with this team. Aces are at a premium and Clemens is really the only potential acquisition that would fill that mold. We need guys that can give us 6 or 7 every time and give up 3 or 4. With our offense we should win more games than not in that type of game.
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Yanksfan03
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Mantlemurcer
May 8 2006, 02:36 PM
Mattingly23
May 8 2006, 02:34 PM
YankeeBaseball
May 8 2006, 01:58 PM

Speaking of Maddux, word on the street is that if the Cubs continue to flounder, he will prolly become available, and if he does, the Yankees are one of the teams who are potentially interested.  :shocked:

I think Ed Whitson has a better chance of starting the Yankees' home playoff opener than Maddux ending up in pinstripes.

Yeah, I don't see Maddux ever ending up here.

Good. He would get bombed.
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PavanosBalls
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I don't know what it really has to do with the topic, but I found this picture of Maddux funny. Look like anyone familiar to us Posted Image
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Yanksfan03
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PavanosBalls
May 8 2006, 10:55 PM
I don't know what it really has to do with the topic, but I found this picture of Maddux funny. Look like anyone familiar to us Posted Image

Yeah, Tanya Sturtze. :laugh:

Their careers have taken slightly different paths though.
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PavanosBalls
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Yanksfan03
May 8 2006, 10:42 PM
PavanosBalls
May 8 2006, 10:55 PM
I don't know what it really has to do with the topic, but I found this picture of Maddux funny. Look like anyone familiar to us Posted Image

Yeah, Tanya Sturtze. :laugh:

Their careers have taken slightly different paths though.

I dunno how it's possible but he looks even douchier than Tanya.
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NYJ EcKo151
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2nd straight Complete Game... :smirk:
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