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| problem with mo? | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Mar 14 2005, 10:23 PM (664 Views) | |
| Giambi_MVP_25 | Mar 15 2005, 03:43 PM Post #31 |
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Misunderstood Genius
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:laugh: |
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| Strider | Mar 15 2005, 04:03 PM Post #32 |
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Problem with Mo is that he's a choker. <_<
Hideki Irabu was the Japanese Roger Clemens, wasn't he? Komiyama was supposed to be Greg Maddux, wasn't he? Kaz Matsui was supposed to be able to catch and throw, wasn't he? Hell, Scott Proctor was throwing 98-100 mph lava, wasn't he? Wang throws 87-88 mph with no movement. No question about it. |
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| Yanksfan03 | Mar 15 2005, 04:34 PM Post #33 |
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VC 4 Life.
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He's paid to pitch one frickin' inning. I am so sick of how these guys get pampered. f*cking pathetic. Way back in the day, guys would start and finish games and then be back out a day or two later. Today, baseball players are a bunch of wimps. |
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| Mantlemurcer | Mar 15 2005, 04:44 PM Post #34 |
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He didn't pitch one friggin inning though. |
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| Yanksfan03 | Mar 15 2005, 04:51 PM Post #35 |
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VC 4 Life.
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Oh I'm sorry, sometimes we have to stretch him out and have him pitch 2 innings. God forbid we go to three, that's asking too much of a guy making $10 mil a year to throw a baseball. :rolleyes: |
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| cmnyy | Mar 15 2005, 04:54 PM Post #36 |
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Group: Self-Appointed Administrators
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Yes, its probably just that simple Yanks03. Or maybe he's just lazy? He doesn't want to pitch anymore than one inning. :no1: |
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| Strider | Mar 15 2005, 04:54 PM Post #37 |
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MM, if you're gonna bust balls because he left out "...one inning per appearance", then come on. How many innings did Rivera pitch? Guarantee it was under 100. Jeez-Louise-sweet Mary Joseph-lawdy lord-oh my guh'ness-heavenly father.....he pitched in 74 games. GASP! And to think, he's only making $10M per season. We're running a child labor sweat shop. :crybaby: |
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| Strider | Mar 15 2005, 04:56 PM Post #38 |
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03 beat me to it. But you got the point. You'll dispute it and kiss that ass until forever, but we're right. |
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| Mantlemurcer | Mar 15 2005, 05:02 PM Post #39 |
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It wasn't about him leaving out 1 inning per appearance, dumbass. Yeah, I called you dumbass. The point is that the constant grind over the years has to catch up to you and Torre overworked him last year. |
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| Yanksfan03 | Mar 15 2005, 05:04 PM Post #40 |
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VC 4 Life.
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Yes, it really is that simple. And it's not just pitchers either. Look at John Olerud in the ALCS. He bruised his instep and sat out 4 of the most important games of the year. :laugh: :-| |
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| Yanksfan03 | Mar 15 2005, 05:07 PM Post #41 |
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VC 4 Life.
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Yeah, the constant grind of throwing 95 innings a year tops has really started to take its toll. Wow, was he ever overused. :-| |
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| cmnyy | Mar 15 2005, 05:10 PM Post #42 |
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Well here's the problem with the Rivera bashing: Many knowledgeable baseball fans/analysts/players consider him to be the BEST EVER at what he does. And I'll guarantee you those who don't have him in at least the top 3 or 5. But yet this isn't good enough for you. Whenever he's slips up you want him dead. Take him away and you can subtract at least 2 Championships from the dynasty. He was the MVP of the 96-2000 Yankees, and for that he gets a lifetime pass from me. |
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| Strider | Mar 15 2005, 05:11 PM Post #43 |
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Every year, that same thing is said. Would you be happy with 25 appearances and 25 innings pitched? For $10M, I didn't know 74 games (1 inning pitched in the majority of them) out of 162 was too much to ask. Excuse me for being a dumbass. And I won't pay the comment any mind, MM. We both know that you hope to have a son just like me someday. |
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| Giambi_MVP_25 | Mar 15 2005, 05:16 PM Post #44 |
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Misunderstood Genius
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:clap: |
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| Mantlemurcer | Mar 15 2005, 05:16 PM Post #45 |
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This post proves how little you know about baseball... and Olerud broke a bone. |
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| Yanksfan03 | Mar 15 2005, 05:19 PM Post #46 |
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Game 5 1997 ALDS, Game 7 2001 WS... I gave him passes for those... Game 4 2004 ALCS three outs away from sweeping Boston, he blows the game we go on to lose the series. He doesn't get a pass for this. What he did against Boston not only in the ALCS but in some big regular season games (that July game where A-Rod and Varitek got in to it was won by Boston on a home run that Mo served up to Mueller got Boston started on the come back trail) as well, REALLY pissed me off. For me, it's all about beating Boston and Mo was as big a reason as any for last year's collapse. And for all of his post season success, Mo has also had his share of failures. You can all brush what Gagne's consecutive streak under the rug, but I'd take him on the Yankees over Mo any day at this point. Will I cheer for Mo at an old timer's day or whatever after he retires? Sure, he's one of the great Yankees of all time. But the time is coming where we need to realize that Mo is now just a good closer at best and no longer on a different level than everybody else. And you can be sure I'll boo him when he costs us a game, because I like to win. Especially against the Red Sox. |
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| Strider | Mar 15 2005, 05:19 PM Post #47 |
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I'm not knocking Rivera's career. Overrated as I think its been and he is, I don't dispute him being considered the greatest. But (1) he's pissed me off with his failure in the clutch recently. There's no such thing as a free pass with me. Jeter's my second favorite player and I've been on his overpaid ass since 2001. (2) He's a relief pitcher. You're being paid $10M to come into 60-70 games and get between 3 and 9 outs. I'm not gonna be amazed when you get those outs. Why do you think people kill closers who can't get it done (just read an article in my school newspaper, written by a Met fan and she's killing Aramando. I didn't even remember he pitched for the Mets and they're STILL killing him)? Because when you're called upon to get 3 to 9 outs and you're being paid millions to do just that, you're supposed to be able to get that done. Also, how the hell is a closer the MVP? What happened to the other 7-8 innings of the game? How did they come by the lead? Who was pitching most of the game? CM, you know I love you (in a gay way), but that's almost as preposterous as when you said that Jeter is the best player in the game. |
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| Yanksfan03 | Mar 15 2005, 05:20 PM Post #48 |
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VC 4 Life.
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Yeah, I know nothing about baseball. :-| |
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| Mantlemurcer | Mar 15 2005, 05:21 PM Post #49 |
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:yes: |
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| Strider | Mar 15 2005, 05:22 PM Post #50 |
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With all due respect, friend: Shut the f*ck up. :please: |
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| Zidanman | Mar 15 2005, 05:23 PM Post #51 |
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best case scenario is he gets stronger as the season goes on, since he didn't pitch at all in the winter. i still say billy wagner must be a yankee next season. he'll be pricey but well worth it. something tells me fat man ortiz won't be able to turn on anything wagner throws and manny, who has seemingly become rivera's daddy, would still get some hits, but i bet you wagner would blow him away a lot more often than mo. |
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| Strider | Mar 15 2005, 05:25 PM Post #52 |
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[size=14]WORD![/size] |
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| Zidanman | Mar 15 2005, 05:29 PM Post #53 |
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just like jeter in my opinion, as the post-seasons go on for the yankees without world series titles and without ungodly performances by rivera and jeter, their legacies will still be great, but tarnished for sure. can anyone honestly say anymore that jeter is the best performer in the clutch? every year, his post-season numbers get less and less impressive. the only thing he'll have, due to so many appearances, will be hits and such, but the average has plummeted and the lack of clutch hits has plummeted. he hit .200 against boston last year in the alcs for christ's sake and .233 the alcs before that. the jeter legacy that was established in the late 90s would have never believed such lack of clutchness was possible with jeet. as with rivera, who was known to have ice in his veins, he's looked like a scared kid at times since 2001 world series. hes still done his job more times than not, but some of his blown saves have left a bitter taste to say the least. |
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| Strider | Mar 15 2005, 05:46 PM Post #54 |
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For all the talk of how Jeter rises to the occasion in the playoffs, he went into last season with a .314 post season batting average. The same as his regular season. And with that .200 he hit against Boston, it might be even lower. Here's a question that nobody has answered and I don't think anybody wants to answer: What is clutch? We'll all say its someone who gets it done when it has to be done. Shine when the lights are on. All that. If someone is capable of getting it done by simply upping their focus and intensity because its a big moment, then what about all the other times? Does it mean they're giving a 1/2 effort because its not the big spot? If DJ is able to lock in and find a way to come through in the big spot (I don't believe that), then shouldn't his career average be better than it is? If all you gotta do is treat those May ABs like October, then shouldn't you get focussed so you could hit .500 for the season? What about all the clutch spots in regular season games? Those don't matter? If this is all so, then how come he stunk in the 2001 World Series? How come he stunk in the 2003 World Series. How come he stunk (except for the double, cuz I know you're gonna bring it up) in the 2004 ALCS? 'Splain that to me. I've said the same thing about Mike Vick: We overrate people because of highlight reels and memorable moments. People will remember "The Play" and overlook Jeter's f*ck-ups, just like they pay no attention to Vick's 52% completion percentage, and instead choose to remember "The Run" agaisnt the Vikings. |
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| Zidanman | Mar 15 2005, 05:51 PM Post #55 |
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well, i don't agree with that strider, although it's a good argument. people in all sports have the reputation of raising their game to a higher level when the pressure is up. i dont think that means they aren't putting up their 100% in the other spots. its' just that they know how to raise their game to 150% for a very brief period of time when it's needed the most. obviously, nobody could sustain such a high level of performance for a long period of time. think about it this way. if somebody puts a knife to your throat, you're gonna fight back. you may be the wimpiest, pussiest son of a bitch, but when you need to you are going to fight back. it's called adrenaline, nobody can have an adrenaline rush for very long. but at spots, you can be better than you ever would be in a normal situation. that's all i think that means. but no, jeter no longer applies to that. he hasn't kept his game at the elite level in the post-season like he used to |
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| Mantlemurcer | Mar 15 2005, 05:55 PM Post #56 |
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And the word is bullsh*t. |
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| Mantlemurcer | Mar 15 2005, 06:01 PM Post #57 |
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You base 90% of your opinion on your emotional reaction at that moment. |
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| Strider | Mar 15 2005, 06:30 PM Post #58 |
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:please: And you know you can't knock Strider's arguments. These threads always end the same way: Strider getting in the last word then you (or whoever) giving up. Either you think I'm incorigible or you realize I've got the sh*t on smash and you can't debate my points. It should be the latter. Even the great Mattingly23 shut the f*ck up when I cornered him in our Joe Torre (cuz we've had many arguments) argument. I think you people just need to give it up and start agreeing with me. You can't prove me wrong. |
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| cmnyy | Mar 15 2005, 06:38 PM Post #59 |
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I'm not even saying that I disagree '03. But he still is one of the best, and I'm still glad that's he's the guy we're going to war with. |
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| cmnyy | Mar 15 2005, 06:43 PM Post #60 |
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Would you agree that getting outs 22-27 might be a bit more difficult than the others, when the opposition's adreneline is pumping?
:love: :love: :love: :laugh: I think I said Jeter "could be" the best player in the game, no? And if I did phrase it that way, I still stand by it. |
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