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| PAF as a COIN Air Force; How best it can earn every penny | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Jun 24 2005, 06:07 AM (11,597 Views) | |
| City Hunter | Jun 25 2005, 06:31 PM Post #11 |
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Kung natuloy lang yun Cali/Pinto projects noon o kahit yun ginawang eroplano ng namatay na ATO officer hindi na natin kailangan bumili pa sa mga dayuhan. Still, yun Czech plane is nice. That streamlined replacement for the T38 is nice too. Props are a good choice for close support sa ground troops. I recall on Manokski's page mayroon crop duster variant pa na suggested. |
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Command is about authority, about appointment to a position. Effective leadership is different. It must be learned and practiced in order for it to rise to the level of art. You must love those you lead before you can be an effective leader. You can certainly command without that sense of commitment but you cannot lead without it; and without leadership, command is a hollow experience. .. a vacuum often filled with mistrust and ignorance. Gen. Eric K. Shinseki | |
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| datu | Jun 25 2005, 11:38 PM Post #12 |
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Bingo... XKO. Too bad it does not have the wing mounted .50caliber guns of the ALX. City Hunter said: "I recall on Manokski's page mayroon crop duster variant pa na suggested." Actually it is Opus's site. The Vigilante. Armored, 11 hardpoints, 4,000+ load capacity, 7-hour endurance. US State Department bought them and uses them for drug erradication in countries with drug crops, amongst the beneficiaries but not the least, our ASEAN brothers Thailand and Burma. |
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"F*ck it, Dude. Let's go bowling." ---The Big Lebowski | |
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| City Hunter | Jun 26 2005, 08:31 AM Post #13 |
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Ooops. Thanks for the correction! |
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Command is about authority, about appointment to a position. Effective leadership is different. It must be learned and practiced in order for it to rise to the level of art. You must love those you lead before you can be an effective leader. You can certainly command without that sense of commitment but you cannot lead without it; and without leadership, command is a hollow experience. .. a vacuum often filled with mistrust and ignorance. Gen. Eric K. Shinseki | |
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| israeli | Jun 26 2005, 08:01 PM Post #14 |
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as posted in Opus' website: http://www.timawa.net/modernization-paf.htm AYRES V-1-A Vigilante as COIN Aircraft "But it's a crop-duster!!" Yes... but it's armored, can carry 4,200 lbs of weapons, can stay airborne for 7 hours, and is highly responsive since crop-dusters have to be able to avoid telephone lines and vehicles at the ends of fields when they make their low-level runs. It is also cheap, uncomplicated and easy to maintain. In the 1980s the United States faced a worsening drug problem and adopted a policy of spraying coca plantations in South America and parts of Asia through the US State Department in cooperation with the respective countries' governments. Surplus OV-10 Broncos were modified and used for these roles but the growers threw considerable resources against them, including machine guns, anti-aircraft cannon and even shoulder launched anti-aircraft missiles. It was later realized that the Broncos were vulnerable in the high-threat, low altitude environments they had to operate in. There were also problems integrating the various ducts and spray-bars to the Bronco and the resulting drag compromised performance and degraded handling. In the interim, the US State Department approached Ayres Corporation of Albany, GA to help develop a new "drug eradicator." Ayres specialized in making crop-dusters and owned the rights to the Rockwell Thrush Commander. The resulting aircraft, rolled out in 1983, used an uprated Pratt and Whitney PT6A-65AG turbine engine offering 1,376 hp driving a 9-foot-3-inch five bladed propeller and had an armored two-seat dual control cockpit, an armored back-up fuel tank and provisions for sophisticated communications and navigation equipment. Nine aircraft were delivered to the US State Department inder the designation Turbo-Thrush S2R-T65/5400 NEDS (Narcotics Eradication Delivery System) and were reportedly used in Burma, Thailand, Columbia, Mexico, Guatemala, and Belize. The US State Department and the US Army Electro-Optical Survivability Program funded development of a modified NEDS for strike duties. The resulting aircraft, dubbed Ayres V-1-A Vigilante, was identical to the NEDS except that it was equipped to carry weapons instead of spraying equipment. There are 11 hardpoints (four under each wing and three tandem pylons under the fuselage) with a combined ordnance capacity of 4,200 lbs, possible weapon fits including 2.75-in. folding-fin aerial rocket pods, napalm canisters, Stinger missiles and a variety of bombs. The aircraft can also be fitted with a variety of surveillance equipment including FLIR an LLTV night vision cameras, video recorders and digital data-links for transmitting images to ground stations. The US Border Patrol successfully tested the Vigilante in the nocturnal border-surveilance role but funding for the aircraft was not available and the program ended. The NEDS and Vigilante have a maximum spead of 250 mph and an economical cruising speed of 170 mph. Stall speed with flaps extended is 58 mph. With light loads the aircraft can take-off in 395 ft. Fully-loaded it will take off in 1,250 ft. The Vigilante is said to cost only $1 million each and has an existing worldwide support network, since over 2,500 Thrush crop-dusters have been sold to over 65 countries. An added benefit to using the Vigilante in COIN duties is its low political visibility. It is harder to for the propaganda arm of an insurgent group to demonize before the world press a low-tech modified crop duster than purpose-built military aircraft. The type is also simple enough and may be suited for local production, both for internal security and in the aircraft's primary configuration for agricultural spraying and aerial fire fighting. - maybe the Vigilante will be a good COIN platform but we really want a real ground attack plane, then we must consider the following aircraft: * A-4 Skyhawk ![]() * A-7 Corsair II ![]() * surplus German Alpha Jet As
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| "To secure peace is to prepare for war." - Carl Von Clausewitz | |
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| edwin | Jun 29 2005, 03:44 PM Post #15 |
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For Air Strike, pwede na siguro yung A-10 Thunderbolt. Considering the firepower, survivality and payload. check the link below: http://www.milavia.net/aircraft/a-10/a-10.htm |
![]() It is difficult to say what is impossible, for the dream of yesterday is the hope of today and reality of tomorrow. | |
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| rogerpopee | Jun 29 2005, 05:47 PM Post #16 |
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How about the T2C Buckeye which has external provisions for armaments? Or the T38A Talon specifically its AT38B version which also has provisions for armaments and can cost as low as US$800,000.00 more or less? |
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| 21Scorpio | Jun 29 2005, 06:06 PM Post #17 |
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if we want a true ground attack for our PAF then lets get the AMX..
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| possible | Jul 22 2005, 06:35 AM Post #18 |
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![]() http://www.raytheonaircraft.com 21st century Tora-Tora? |
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War. What is it good for?--James Brown What's love got to do with it?--Tina Turner Only the intelligent are brave. | |
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| Frenzy | Jul 22 2005, 09:00 AM Post #19 |
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Wow, that bird looks mean. I would call that the hotshot mudfighter's wetdream. If we can only afford that... |
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| datu | Jul 22 2005, 03:12 PM Post #20 |
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Beautiful and meanlooking. Still lacks the wing-mounted .50caliberMG of the ALX. According to the raytheon site:
Which might explain the fluxuations of price according to FlugReview:
Might as well get cheapest A version and locally modify them with the 6/7 hardpoints when they are delivered, saves money that way. The PAF's SF-260TP and S.211 are like that. But that would mean the ground attack avionics would not come with the aircraft...standard with the ALX. Still a great plane, like all planes...that are nice to dream over. |
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"F*ck it, Dude. Let's go bowling." ---The Big Lebowski | |
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8:39 AM Jul 11