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| Secondhand Danish ships; Time to shop? | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Feb 16 2005, 10:57 AM (3,527 Views) | |
| 21Scorpio | Feb 22 2005, 11:02 AM Post #11 |
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If the our navy will the resolve to armed our Jacintos with missiles it can be done no sweat. But then bcoz of the ships height limitations they deemed that a missile will be useless. The range of the small missile will just be same with its main gun which has an effective range of 16-18 kms. had the Jacinto's were bigger they could be armed with missiles of longer range. You will note that the navy official selected radamec 1500 as its fire control instead of the 2500 which is just compatible in range with the ships 76mm super rapid main gun. Whats the use of the longer range FC when your gun reach is shortter. It goes to with the missiles the navy cannot mount a longer range radar than 20-25 nm because of the ships height limitations so, even if the Jacintos are armed with missiles the engagement of targets if there's any will still be at the main gun's range that would deem missiles on board as excess baggages. |
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| flipzi | Feb 22 2005, 12:19 PM Post #12 |
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Hmmm. I can believe that. Any other arguments on 21scorpio's view? The Jacinto looks as tall as the Danish FLYVEFISKEN Class ships though. Is it really impossible to install the radar in the mast or platform where the radar could be fixed onto? Is there really no way for the Navy to put the launchers on that ship? Can you elaborate more on this please? |
![]() " Sovereignty resides in the people and all government authority emanates from them! - Art. II Sec 1, Philippine Constitution " " People don't care what we know until they know we care. " getflipzi@yahoo.com | |
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| 21Scorpio | Feb 23 2005, 11:49 AM Post #13 |
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The navy the way i see it is beginning to plan for power projection well beyond its seashores. However they are very carefull in going onwards and they want to start it right by securing first its shorelines. As you can see in their program of aquisitions they wanted corvettes and assault crafts and a few Offshore Patrol Boats. They know that they cannot have capital ships at the flip of a finger as it would entail big budget appropriations and the govt is not capable at this time. The navy is at the moment is concentrating on inshore defence up to 100 nm and they rely on the Air Force armed with anti-ship ordnance to intercept vessels that are far beyond and they will be ready deal with for any fast craft that will sneak past the airforce line of defence. This will be apparent in a decade when their bigger combatants are not yet in place. Then as their means increases their plan will slowly shift to high gear and over the horizon defence. Maybe in 2 decades if the econmy of the country continue its trend we can see a Blue water Philippine Navy |
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| flipzi | Feb 23 2005, 12:21 PM Post #14 |
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Is this real? Wow! Right way to go for our Navy! :thumb: :thumb: |
![]() " Sovereignty resides in the people and all government authority emanates from them! - Art. II Sec 1, Philippine Constitution " " People don't care what we know until they know we care. " getflipzi@yahoo.com | |
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| Fallen Angel | Mar 1 2005, 05:57 PM Post #15 |
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Viking, what are usually the terms of sale for these second hand vessels in Europe? |
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| kinf | Mar 4 2005, 06:17 PM Post #16 |
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buy the subs - those are good boats |
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| horge | Mar 7 2005, 09:38 AM Post #17 |
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Hi, You do NOT want to mess too much with mast height on the Jacinto hull, which is already roll-prone, bilge-keels or no. What you can do is use radar drones (unmanned) periodically and briefly to have a look-see up top, increasing your radar range immensely. In case of a target that needs servicing, then the drone can stay up there, from missile launch to close-in. You can even resort to tethered (power cable and data), balloon assisted 'drones'. This is stuff that can be developed locally and privately. If you want to go the homegrown route, then you have to address self-correction issues: obviously the shipboard nav/weapons comp will have to keep track of where the drone is sitting and more importantly, where the drone's transmitter is pointing (down to the millisecond) relative to the ship's true center and bearings, and compensate for data received. You can do that via a high bandwidth tether ( the tether also helps with recovery, in case of accident) --and it helps tons if the drone has some propulsion capability to help maintain its own position and bearing relative to the ship. Getting a drone/balloon up 10-50 meters doesn't sound like much, but Raising your mast thereby ....10-50 meters can mean something. Obviously, weather capability requirements are going to factor heavily into any putative drone's design and cost. I kind of like the kevlar balloon route: having cheap spare balloons to tether a transceiver onto, all power taken from the ship via cable-tether. :) horge |
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| 21Scorpio | Mar 7 2005, 09:58 AM Post #18 |
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Hi Jorqe, that was a brilliant sugeestion. The Navy could use unmanned aerial vhicle to increase Jacinto's range. One question though. what type? and can the Jacinto as small as it is able to support it especially in the high seas? |
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| horge | Mar 8 2005, 08:02 AM Post #19 |
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Hi, What's to make space for, really? Room for the data/power tether ---a measly 50-60 meters of it. Room for the transceiver pod --we are talking about a very large suitcase-sized implement, of a lightweight (Al or Ti) shell probably shaped like a finned hotdog with a tumor (the dome) underneath There's no fuel storage to consider, as it takes AC/DC straight from the ship. You'll need emergency tanks of helium, no biggie there. Uninflated balloons take up only a bit of space. The main tech issue is monitoring and compensating for drone position and orientation relative to the ship's. That technology is off-the-shelf military commodity. There's rewiring a data bypass towards the tether terminal up top, that serves and anchors the drone tether --I dunno if there is conduit space for that, or if PN will have to lay new pipe. You'd need space for one or two more navcomps, but I don't know how much space is left for that down in the pit since PN started having fun with the boat configuration... nor how much available power remains onboard. Again, if it's a fair weather, dead stop proposition, then it's qite possible. If it's to be all-weather, ship at full speed ---mmmm, depends. The PN is a pretty resourceful organization. I'd be shocked if they'd not considered this several times before, and with far more comprehension than I can bring to bear. There are even BETTER solutions (like, build a better boat!) Pesos, and Political will, man. Both are beyond the PN's control, as should be. . |
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| Viking | Mar 10 2005, 08:46 PM Post #20 |
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I am not sure about the Danish rules but it should be the standard rules, like not selling to dictatorships and human right abusers and probably a clause about you must have permission to sell it to a third party. as for the harpoon equipment you need US aproval. |
| Draft beer, not people | |
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