The China Threat

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The China Threat; military, political, economic, etc.
Tweet Topic Started: Sep 16 2004, 01:56 AM (13,555 Views)
adroth	Aug 27 2005, 04:36 AM Post #51
Member Posts: 1,127 Group: Regulars Member #13 Joined: July 12, 2004	Even my Mandarin instructor said that my pinyin sucks, but here goes. MSantor Aug 26 2005, 08:34 AM ADROTH, Ni Zhu zai Tai Wan, dui bu dui? Bu dui. Zhen zai, wuo zai meiguo. Quote: Ni shi zai na li zhu? Wuo zai Tai Wan de she ho, wuo zai Taipei. Ni ne? Quote: (Geez I wish I could type in characters in this foruminstead) The only chinese characters I know are about food. I'm not Chinese, so I only know enough to get by. Quote: It's just that I don't think the PLA sees any inherent value in landing troops in the Philippine islands- the Spratlys excluded of course. If China expands somewhere in the near future (beyond Taiwan and its current borders), I think it will probably head North or West to the former Soviet Republics- I think Kazakhstan has oil. The threat is not imminent. Nevertheless, the capability is there, and intentions can very easily change -- especially since the Chinese government is not beholden to its people. If they really do find oil in the Spratlys, things could get interesting.
	Avatar c/o: http://www.proudlypinoy.org/ Defense of the Republic of the Philippines (DefensePH)


MSantor	Aug 27 2005, 07:48 AM Post #52
Posts: 28,658 Group: PDFF Mod Group Member #516 Joined: August 6, 2005	Xian Zai Wo Ye Zhu Zai Mei Guo. (Now I also live in the US) Wo Zhu Zai Tai Wan De Shi Hou (When I lived in Taiwan), Wo Ye Zhu Guo Zai Tai Bei (I also lived in Taipei). Wo Shang Tai Bei Mei Guo Xue Xiao Liang Nian (I attended Taipei American School for two years). Wo Bu Shi Han ren/ Hua ren Zhong Guo Ren- wo shi zhen zhen de Fei Li Bin Ren (I am not Chinese, a true-blue Filipino). Wo shi Da Xue Sheng De Shi Hou, Wo Ye zai Bei Jing Xue Han Yu Liu Yue (When I was a college student I also studied Mandarin in Beijing for Six Months). Wo Xiang Xin Fei Lib Bin De Jun Ren Bu Pa Jie Fang Jun De Da Xiao (I believe that the Filipino soldier does not fear the might of the PLA!) YI ZHE ZOU (SUGOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)
	"If you think you can do a thing or think you can't do a thing, you're right." - Henry Ford "Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm." - Winston Churchill "If everyone is thinking alike, someone isn't thinking"- Gen. George S. Patton


adroth	Aug 27 2005, 08:26 AM Post #53
Member Posts: 1,127 Group: Regulars Member #13 Joined: July 12, 2004	Zhen zai, wuo bu neng lienshi wuo de zhong wen. Xie xie MSantor. Your Mandarin far exceeds mine. Quote: Wo Xiang Xin Fei Lib Bin De Jun Ren Bu Pa Jie Fang Jun De Da Xiao (I believe that the Filipino soldier does not fear the might of the PLA!)
	Avatar c/o: http://www.proudlypinoy.org/ Defense of the Republic of the Philippines (DefensePH)


brassballs	Aug 27 2005, 11:26 AM Post #54
Member Posts: 409 Group: Regulars Member #453 Joined: May 5, 2005	israeli Aug 26 2005, 12:48 PM saver111: yeah... but... just a thought. i don't know if you will agree with me or not. will it be "wise" for the Philippines to buy Chinese since the Americans seem to be "unreliable" as of the moment. just look at the Thais. some of their equipment are Chinese made and yet, they are able to use them quite efficiently despite doubts on the quality of Chinese-made weapons and equipment. Unreliable??? Remember thousands upon thousands and counting the number of American troops killed and maimed and american equipments damaged and destroyed by chinese made equipments. From the Korean war, Vietnam war and now in Iraq some if not most equipments used are chinese made and also in Afghanistan some of their equipments are chinese made. Israeli never underestimate the Chinese made weapons they know it works and its cheaper to mass produce that is why they stick with it, they are smarter than you think. If I was in charge in procuring weapons for the AFP and with limited budget for counter insurgency I would not think twice in buying chinese made weapons for a good bang for my buck.If it would make my AFP more stronger and with an array of firepower that will do the job for less amount? why the hell not..if it will deal with the rebels and the terrorists go for it..Practicality and simple mindedness is sometimes the answer to our prayers.
	Shock the monkey....!


israeli	Aug 27 2005, 11:37 AM Post #55
Posts: 3,069 Group: Elite Member #22 Joined: July 13, 2004	brassballs: okay. if that's the case, is the AFP up to the challenge of purchasing Chinese-made weapons and equipment? you know so well that the AFP has this "anything American is the best" kind of mindset.
	"To secure peace is to prepare for war." - Carl Von Clausewitz


brassballs	Aug 27 2005, 02:12 PM Post #56
Member Posts: 409 Group: Regulars Member #453 Joined: May 5, 2005	israeli Aug 27 2005, 11:37 AM brassballs: okay. if that's the case, is the AFP up to the challenge of purchasing Chinese-made weapons and equipment? you know so well that the AFP has this "anything American is the best" kind of mindset. It is not a challenge but a mindset. Do they have to go to a pretty desperate situation to swallow such mindset? they might have to. But the debate is: Is the Chinese made weapons unreliable ? My answer is NO..the proof? korean War, Vietnam War, War on Terrorism..The nuke development of third world countries thanks to China's help with harnessing such technology. We said the same thing when Japan was emerging from the second world war, that Japanese products are unreliable..we said the same thing with Taiwan on my generation..But where are those countries now economy wise and militarily??? We are we now???
	Shock the monkey....!


saver111	Aug 27 2005, 02:45 PM Post #57
PDFF Moderator Posts: 10,625 Group: PDFF Mod Group Member #408 Joined: March 23, 2005	israeli, brassball, MSantor I think, I misread Israeli's , oops Quote: saver111: yeah... but... just a thought. i don't know if you will agree with me or not. will it be "wise" for the Philippines to buy Chinese since the Americans seem to be "unreliable" as of the moment. just look at the Thais. some of their equipment are Chinese made and yet, they are able to use them quite efficiently despite doubts on the quality of Chinese-made weapons and equipment. I believe his statement meant the U.S. wait , wait and see attitude that is "unreliable" and not the Chinese technology. As you go along you could see all our points agree, "Why wait? When there are other sources within our budget that could also provide the much needed defense equipment. If those Chinese equipments are unreliable, why do we fear them? As to our AFP's mindset as pro-American, we can't blame them since most of our doctrines are patterned after them. Most of our existing equipment are made from them. Recently read that AFP's refusal to accept Chinese offer for communication equipments because of these reasons. And remember some equipments are donated by the U.S. But I do believe also, with the U.S. seeing us doing our share to improve our AFP with all the little budget we got, they won't mind at all. We heard it from them, if we want those things, buy! But if we can't afford them, why wait, buy alternatives that could do the job. Any shortages, that's the time the U.S. will provide it, but certainly not all of it. But seeing the trend, if you're with them, follow their lead. That is, you got to be NATO-compatible. The reason for those surplus equipments from NATO members, now available for third world countries, like us.
	Justice for Daniel Lorenz Jacinto HELP END PIRACY NOW!: http://www.itfseafarers.org/petition.cfm


israeli	Aug 27 2005, 03:15 PM Post #58
Posts: 3,069 Group: Elite Member #22 Joined: July 13, 2004	saver111: exactly. if we can't get the weapons and equipment that we need from the Americans, then we just have to get them somewhere else. the Russians or perhaps even the Chinese can give us a discount when we get our stuff from them. as for the quality of Chinese products, i still have reservations regarding the quality but i believe that it always boils down to the way the customer uses such products. an example of which will be the Pakistanis and the Thais, both of whom use Chinese-made weapons and equipment very efficiently. also, if the Chinese will offer us products that can fully re-equip the AFP at a much lower price, then we must take advantage of that opportunity. the only thing that really deters me from the idea of buying Chinese is the fact that we're getting our weapons and equipment from the same country that is threatening the sovereignty of the Republic of the Philippines.
	"To secure peace is to prepare for war." - Carl Von Clausewitz


brassballs	Aug 27 2005, 04:06 PM Post #59
Member Posts: 409 Group: Regulars Member #453 Joined: May 5, 2005	israeli Aug 27 2005, 03:15 PM saver111: exactly. if we can't get the weapons and equipment that we need from the Americans, then we just have to get them somewhere else. the Russians or perhaps even the Chinese can give us a discount when we get our stuff from them. as for the quality of Chinese products, i still have reservations regarding the quality but i believe that it always boils down to the way the customer uses such products. an example of which will be the Pakistanis and the Thais, both of whom use Chinese-made weapons and equipment very efficiently. also, if the Chinese will offer us products that can fully re-equip the AFP at a much lower price, then we must take advantage of that opportunity. the only thing that really deters me from the idea of buying Chinese is the fact that we're getting our weapons and equipment from the same country that is threatening the sovereignty of the Republic of the Philippines. Worries about China as a potential enemy is very valid..but if you think about that even Russia has the foresight of having the Chinese as a potential adversary since the 1950's and even to this day but they still cooperate with defense related issues ut of practicality. as far as the AFP is concerned about buying weapons from China it would probably take a very innovative higher ranking officer to convince the others and the politicians for a change of pace.
	Shock the monkey....!


MSantor	Aug 28 2005, 12:00 AM Post #60
Posts: 28,658 Group: PDFF Mod Group Member #516 Joined: August 6, 2005	How about procuring Chinese J-6s, J-7s, J-8s FBC-1s and Q-5s to augment our Air Force? A Qinghua university professor I was talking to when I was in Beijing (a former PLAAF pilot too) guararntees that these planes cost lesser than US-made ones. Burma and Cambodia also operate some of those Chinese made planes. Yeah I know the first two aircraft are relics but then again we already are operating relics! (No offence to F-5A buffs).
	"If you think you can do a thing or think you can't do a thing, you're right." - Henry Ford "Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm." - Winston Churchill "If everyone is thinking alike, someone isn't thinking"- Gen. George S. Patton


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