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Philippines & Vietnam in the South China Sea; updates, discussions
Topic Started: Mar 29 2012, 08:20 PM (1,958 Views)
pachador


Hong Nam
May 23 2014, 02:06 AM
Ergh... That is exactly what the preceding article said.
I know that hong, im just restating also what i have said last year in this forum about what the philippines should do. repetition and restating are effective learning tools for readers if the poster is trying to drive home a message over and over again.( i have a quixotic mission lols)



Edited by pachador, May 23 2014, 02:14 AM.
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Uruzu
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Deploying 130 ships , mobilising troops near border, this all looks like they planned this beforehand.

Again this is a reminder that China ALWAYS do this when there's a crisis/opportunity.

-Paracel Islands , when South Vietnam is helpless after the US pullout.
-Spratyl Skirmish, when (unified) Vietnam is isolated in the 1980s.
-Mischief Reef, when the Philippines is vulnerable after the close of US bases.
-Oil rig inside Vietnam's EEZ, when there is a crisis somewhere else for diversion , i.e everyone is looking at Ukraine.

Still, I do not get why China is determined to push Vietnam to be so openly hostile.

2 years ago, I would never have imagine a Vietnamese PM and a Filipino president coming together making a strong statement against China, or discussing maritime and defence cooperation, or threatening to join's Manila's legal action.

Seems like they don't care about PR anymore. It's like they're learning from Russia's Ukraine adventure by the book.
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Santi Kampilan
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Uruzu
May 23 2014, 02:44 AM
Deploying 130 ships , mobilising troops near border, this all looks like they planned this beforehand.

Again this is a reminder that China ALWAYS do this when there's a crisis/opportunity.

-Paracel Islands , when South Vietnam is helpless after the US pullout.
-Spratyl Skirmish, when (unified) Vietnam is isolated in the 1980s.
-Mischief Reef, when the Philippines is vulnerable after the close of US bases.
-Oil rig inside Vietnam's EEZ, when there is a crisis somewhere else for diversion , i.e everyone is looking at Ukraine.

Still, I do not get why China is determined to push Vietnam to be so openly hostile.

2 years ago, I would never have imagine a Vietnamese PM and a Filipino president coming together making a strong statement against China, or discussing maritime and defence cooperation, or threatening to join's Manila's legal action.

Seems like they don't care about PR anymore. It's like they're learning from Russia's Ukraine adventure by the book.
Seems like they don't care about PR anymore. It's like they're learning from Russia's Ukraine adventure by the book.

- They are bolder because they see America's leadership is weak. They know Obama will never push them against the wall. We will have to wait until after 2016 who the next "pussy" or John Wayne will be.
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Hong Nam
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Bought by China

Analysts: Vietnam Seeking Closer Ties With Philippines
Trung Nguyen
May 23, 2014 9:51 PM



WASHINGTON - After a visit to the Philippines this week by Vietnam's prime minister, analysts say it is apparent Hanoi is committed to deepening its relationship with Manila in the face of similar maritime disputes with China.

Analysts said his strong statement in the presence of Philippine President Benigno Aquino shows Hanoi's apparent move to gather support.


"Hanoi is seeking a "common voice" with Manila in order to deal with Beijing. The two countries have similar interests in the South China Sea and are facing challenges posed by China. Therefore, it is normal and natural that they talk to each other to find a mutual way out. But I do not think it is a military alliance, as Vietnam does not have a policy regarding that aspect."

- Professor Nguyen Manh Hung, George Mason University


"China's aggressive attitude has triggered counter-actions binding countries with similar concerns together. We learn from each other's experience because we know that everything is interconnected in this modern world. They [China] are occupying parts of our exclusive economic zones and they are doing it to you [Vietnam] also. So we have to take a stand now. Otherwise, China will keep on doing it, and try to occupy everything there."
- Roilo Golez


"A small country that confronts a big neighbor like China, Vietnam should 'rely on an international legal basis and follow in the Philippines' footsteps. Vietnam could bring China to the tribunal at any time, but it needs to do thorough research to see what aspect of the dispute could be used [against China]. Those should be related to Vietnam, and [Hanoi] could not simply copy the Philippines' actions."
- Vu Quang Viet


Voice of America


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Hong Nam
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Bought by China

China says Vietnam claims to disputed islets 'ridiculous'
Reuters
3 hours ago



"Seeing that the Vietnamese Foreign Ministry held a press conference last Friday on the subject, I felt it was extremely ridiculous. The Paracels are the indisputable territory of the Chinese people. They had been part of Chinese territory since the Han dynasty, and that Chinese explorers had first discovered the islands."

- Qin Gang, Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesman


Reuters



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Bastion
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of course it is ridiculous for China, the Vietnamese forgot to include a nine dash line in their map, If only the Vietnamese remembered to make those lines in their map, they could have even included Beijing inside their 9 dash line, then everything would have been perfectly legal with the Chinese. it wouldn't even strain their relations with China, Not a tiny bit.
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pachador


any islands or reefs outside the 200 mile EEZ is essentially free-for-all and up for grabs . i think parts of paracel as well as spratly islands is outside the 200 mile eez of either china or vietnam or philippines.example is Pagasa island which is 280 miles from palawan -we just got pagasa island first(naunahan natin yung iba). (not sure though if its part of the philippines extended continental shelf. ) anyone have info on which are the other free-for-all islands ?
however, mischief reef, scarborough reef, south johnson reef, ayungin shoal -these are all within the 200 mile EEZ
I got part of the answer here: http://globalnation.inquirer.net/99689/unclos-explained-why-chinas-claims-in-south-china-sea-are-invalid?PageSpeed=noscript
Edited by pachador, May 27 2014, 12:38 AM.
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MSantor
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PDFF Mod Group
There is a report (breaking news) that says:

Tuoitre News (Vietnam site)

Quote:
 
"At 4 pm May 26, about 40 Chinese fishing boats surrounded a group of Vietnamese fishing ships in an area about 17 nautical miles south-southwest from the location where China’s oil rig Haiyang Shiyou 981 has been placed illegally since May 1 ... Suddenly, Chinese fishing boat #11209 crashed into Vietnamese fishing ship DNa 90152 with 10 fishermen on board ... The hard hit sank the local ship and some Vietnamese fishing boats operating nearby managed to save all the 10 crew members."

"If you think you can do a thing or think you can't do a thing, you're right." - Henry Ford

"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm."
- Winston Churchill


"If everyone is thinking alike, someone isn't thinking"- Gen. George S. Patton
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Hong Nam
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Bought by China

Philippines, Vietnam Reject Xi's Warning Against Military Alliances
Vietnam and the Philippines are growing closer together over Beijing's claims and provocations.
By Tyler Roney
May 23, 2014



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With other diplomatic endeavors falling flat and China's seemingly perpetual stranglehold over the Association of South East Asian Nations (ASEAN), Vietnam and the Philippines have few options left in curbing China's expansion. However, considering China's constant spats with many of its neighbors and endless claims to territory, this could be a novel way to combat China's expansion.

Vietnam and the Philippines appear unmoved by Beijing's condemnations and threats and are growing closer over Beijing's claims and provocations.

"It's unprecedented for Vietnam to join a U.S. ally and appeal directly for international support."
- Carl Thayer, Australian Defense Force Academy

This strange show of diplomatic camaraderie against a common adversary is indeed rare, but, frankly, China has left them little choice. Vietnam and the Philippines can not look for help directly from the ASEAN, as some of the nations involved do not have pressing territorial problems with China, and the Middle Kingdom's righteous indignation is a force to be feared indeed.

But, despite claimant nations being shouted down at the ASEAN and passed over at CICA, they can still give Beijing headaches by working together.

"I believe that continued cooperation with Vietnam as well as other members of ASEAN in defense and security will only contribute to promoting regional stability. It is not an overstatement when I say that I look forward to increased collaboration between our respective defense agencies."
- President Benigno Aquino III

China, however, rejects this view, claiming that further cooperation between Southeast Asian nations to counter China's claims would be harmful to regional security.

Diplomatically, China has no trouble condemning, dismissing, and lambasting criticism on all sides by every nation in Southeast Asia, but accomplishments within the ASEAN sphere are not the only option for the many nations annoyed by China's increased aggression. In the realm of public opinion - considering the only items China has in its diplomatic tool kit are a hammer and ear plugs - claimants can make ground and lose little by banding together on these disputes.

The Philippines and Vietnam have managed to become odd bedfellows in the diplomatic melée to keep China out of the South China Sea. If their gambit has a positive effect, others may want to follow suit.


The Diplomat





Edited by Hong Nam, May 27 2014, 01:02 PM.

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Hong Nam
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Bought by China

MSantor
May 27 2014, 01:51 AM
There is a report (breaking news) that says:

Tuoitre News (Vietnam site)

Quote:
 
"At 4 pm May 26, about 40 Chinese fishing boats surrounded a group of Vietnamese fishing ships in an area about 17 nautical miles south-southwest from the location where China’s oil rig Haiyang Shiyou 981 has been placed illegally since May 1 ... Suddenly, Chinese fishing boat #11209 crashed into Vietnamese fishing ship DNa 90152 with 10 fishermen on board ... The hard hit sank the local ship and some Vietnamese fishing boats operating nearby managed to save all the 10 crew members."



The Chinese would like you to believe that a wooden hulled fishing vessel would willingly ram a steel hulled vessel.

Quote:
 
Vietnam accuses China of sinking fishing boat
By CHRIS BRUMMITT
Associated Press - 4 hours ago


HANOI, Vietnam (AP) - Vietnam and China traded accusations Tuesday over who was the aggressor in a clash that led to the sinking of a Vietnamese fishing boat in the South China Sea, sharpening tensions already dangerously high after China moved an oil rig into the disputed waters.


"Monday's incident was the first time a Vietnamese boat had been sunk. I call this an act of attempted murder because the Chinese sank a Vietnamese fishing boat and then ran away. We vehemently protest this perverse, brutal and inhumane action by Chinese side."

- Tran Van Linh, Fisheries Association president

"The Vietnamese fishing boat had forced its way into the area around the oil rig and rammed into a Chinese fishing boat. I think the fact that this incident happened at all shows that Vietnam's illegitimate and illegal harassment and sabotage against China's regular operations are futile and will only hurt their own interests."

- Qin Gang, Foreign Ministry spokesman


AP / Yahoo


Either of these two things:

1) They think everyone else are mor-ons.

or

2) They themselves are the mor-ons because they couldn't think of a better excuse.


Edited by Hong Nam, May 27 2014, 10:53 PM.

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