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| HK Bus Hostage Tragedy 2010 (aftermath. etc.); updates, discussions | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Aug 23 2010, 12:08 PM (6,544 Views) | |
| Aerocobra | Aug 24 2010, 02:03 PM Post #61 |
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My brother is a member of the New Jersey State Police SWAT unit and he said that each and everyone of them were taught location and how to open emergency exits of buses and trains. These exits can be opened from the outside in the event of accidents or hostage situations like what happened here. He was actually shouting at the TV screen as if the PNP SWAT could hear him to use the emergency exit, he was flabbergasted that the PNP doesn't know about those emergency exits. He said if it was his SWAT doing the entry, they would have all the spotlights shut, execute rapid assault with one team to make a diversionary noisy breach at front of the bus while actual assault team open the emergency exit, pop flash bangs and gas followed immediately by two operators to take down the bad guy. Over in less than 10 minutes. |
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| raider1011 | Aug 24 2010, 02:34 PM Post #62 |
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No clear command caused Grandstand tragedy—Biazon MANILA, Philippines—The hostage-taking crisis at the Rizal Grandstand was the result of a police situation that had no clear person in command, Muntinlupa Representative Rodolfo Biazon said Tuesday. Biazon, chairman of the House committee on defense and national security, said a better handling of the crisis could have averted the loss of lives. Biazon, a former senator and Armed Forces of the Philippines chief, said it should have been known from the start who was the ground commander in charge and who will decide the tactics and resources to be used, including the hostage-taker's relatives. Directly under the ground commander should have been an experienced negotiator, who can directly communicate to the hostage-taker. Then there should have also been the tactical commander, who is in charge of the assault force. "There should be layers of command, and not everybody can talk or negotiate with the hostage-taker. Ang daming nakisawsaw (Too many were intervening). The worst thing you can do is to confuse the hostage-taker or agitate him," Biazon said in a phone interview. Biazon also wondered why Mendoza was still carrying firearms when he should have surrendered it when he was dismissed in February 2009. "Who owns the gun he used? We should trace the ownership of that firearm," He added. He said he supports the ongoing investigation ordered by President Benigno Aquino III, adding that Congress should first leave the inquiry to the proper authorities. Biazon said the incident will be a "black eye" to the country's reputation, especially to the tourism industry. "It will take some time to repair it," he added. http://newsinfo.inquirer.net/breakingnews/...d-tragedyBiazon |
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God grant me the courage not to give up what I think is right even though I think it is hopeless. || Chester W. Nimitz Loyalty to the Nation ALL the time, loyalty to the Government when it deserves it. || Mark Twain | |
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| fatbat_mca | Aug 24 2010, 02:45 PM Post #63 |
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biazon at his alarmist best, again. one of our businessess is a travel agency and the manager told me that bookings from other parts of the world are still coming in, only hong kong clients have cancelled. we even have bookings from china |
oh my sofie!
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| raider1011 | Aug 24 2010, 03:00 PM Post #64 |
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Unbelievable. Tikom-bibig na nga sa sinabi ng tao, maghahanap pa ng konsuelo. So is going at it with a sledgehammer the best an "expert" can do? So many questions: what unit did the assault team belong to? How was the commander chosen? Where was PNP SAF? So many worthwhile things to dwell on than just jumping to the defense. |
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God grant me the courage not to give up what I think is right even though I think it is hopeless. || Chester W. Nimitz Loyalty to the Nation ALL the time, loyalty to the Government when it deserves it. || Mark Twain | |
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| Tormentor | Aug 24 2010, 03:20 PM Post #65 |
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PNP-SAF offered its own assault team which is better-equipped and better-trained than the district SWAT teams but MPD refused asserting their SWAT team can do the job as well. |
![]() It's a bird, it's a plane...no...it's Super Trillanes! | |
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| saver111 | Aug 24 2010, 05:07 PM Post #66 |
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Posted by maverick at the other forum (no link attached)
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Justice for Daniel Lorenz Jacinto HELP END PIRACY NOW!: http://www.itfseafarers.org/petition.cfm | |
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| fatbat_mca | Aug 24 2010, 05:33 PM Post #67 |
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inconsistencies in the above story.. hostage with a slashed neck was male, not female how can he see all the things that happened if he was huddled under the seat? |
oh my sofie!
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| Frenzy | Aug 24 2010, 06:08 PM Post #68 |
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Why did not the PNP High Command ordered the MPD to accept the SAF's offer? SAF for sure have the better equipment, they have gas masks, they have the breaching equipment and the vehicles, their operators are better trained and with the better weapons, so how come its assault team was not made the lead team instead of the MPD's clearly ill-equipped and ill-trained team? |
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| israeli | Aug 24 2010, 06:48 PM Post #69 |
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Tsang slams siege tactics Dennis Eng and Raissa Robles in Manila, Martin Wong and Tanna Chong South China Morning Post Tuesday, August 24, 2010 Chief Executive Donald Tsang Yam-kuen criticised the handling of a hostage crisis in Manila last night in which eight Hong Kong tourists were killed and two critically injured. Police commandos stormed the tour bus on which they were being held and shot the gunman in the head. The Chinese embassy in Manila said seven of the Hongkongers on the bus survived the dramatic siege. The names of those killed and injured were not released. Mendoza was honoured by police chiefs in 1986 as one of the top 10 officers in the country. But he was dismissed in 2008 for alleged involvement in drug-related crimes and extortion, police said. He took the hostages in an attempt to demand his job back and to have his name cleared. His body was seen slumped out of the shattered front door of the bus last night with a bullet wound to the head. "It is most regrettable," said Tsang who appeared close to tears during a press conference. "The way it was handled, particularly the outcome, I find is disappointing." Tsang said he had tried to call Philippine President Benigno Aquino but could not get through. "I hope the Philippines government can give me a full account of what happened," he said. Thousands in Hong Kong watched as the hostage drama unfolded live on TV. The tour group left the city for the Philippines on Friday and was originally scheduled to arrive home last night. Their tour company, Hong Thai Travel, became aware of the unfolding drama when the tour guide made a secret phone call to the company from the back of the bus, unknown to the gunman. "We immediately called our people there and were told the police and military had already reached there," Hong Thai Travel general manager Susanna Lau Mei-sze said. Twenty-two Hong Kong tourists and three Filipinos were aboard the bus when Mendoza seized the vehicle demanding he be reinstated. He released nine people during police negotiations, including two Filipinos. As negotiations to free the remaining hostages failed, Mendoza threatened to kill the hostages. "I shot two Chinese. I will finish them all if they do not stop," Mendoza told Radio Mindanao Network about 10 hours into the drama. "I can see a lot of SWAT [special weapons and tactics police] coming in. I know they will kill me. They should all leave, because anytime I will do the same here." The Filipino driver of the bus escaped after cutting himself loose from handcuffs and screamed "Everybody is dead!" as he ran to safety. The attempted storming of the bus after negotiations broke down turned into a debacle with commandos unable to get inside for more than an hour. They encircled the bus, smashed its windows and fired at it, but Mendoza shot back. The crisis eventually ended when police threw tear gas inside the bus and fired again. One woman Hong Kong survivor, whose husband was killed, demanded to know why Manila police came to their rescue so late. "It's too late. Why were there no one to help us after so many hours?" she said at the scene of the siege. "We were in fear for so many hours. I find it really cruel. "There were so many people on the bus - no one came to our rescue. Why? She said her husband was killed as he tried to stop Mendoza from attacking other passengers. "He [her husband] was brave. He rushed out trying to stop the gunman from shooting. I didn't know whether the gunman was dead or not, but there had been non-stop gunshots." Last night, she was looking for her three sons who were also on the bus, aged 14, 18, and 21, and whose conditions was not known. "I really wanted to hold my husband and die with him, but I thought of the children. So I have to protect myself." Aquino expressed condolences to the relatives of those killed. "With the rest of the Filipino people, I wish to offer our deepest condolences to the families of the victims whose lives were lost in the hostage situation," he said. The tactics of the police in not killing the gunman early in the drama were questioned after a photo of the gunman in full view in the open doorway of the bus became public. In Hong Kong, resident Kevin Chan said: "It's a tragedy and a farce. Why did it take them so long to get into the bus? They're not well disciplined and trained. Are they crazy?" City University criminologist Dennis Wong Sing-wing said if the drama had occurred in the United States or on the mainland, the gunman would have been killed much earlier. "It may be due to cultural differences. Filipinos are more easygoing and peace-loving so that they tend not to adopt fierce action. If the same scenario happened in the US or China, snipers would have killed the gunman a long time ago," Wong said. "The negotiators might also have failed to assess the situation correctly, thinking it could be solved without force, as the gunman released a number of hostages." Lawmaker James To Kun-sun said police seemed "a little slow" in breaking into the vehicle. Another lawmaker, Wong Yuk-man, said: "The Filipino police's approach to the incident might be problematic. But the situation changed very suddenly. It may have been a shock for even the police, who were asked to kill." The Hong Kong government has issued a black travel alert, warning against travel to the Philippines. Travel agents in the city will cancel all tours to Manila until further notice. ----- China issues travel warning after Manila hostage-taking South China Morning Post Tuesday, August 24, 2010 BEIJING, Tuesday 24 August 2010 (AFP) - China on Tuesday urged its citizens travelling to the Philippines to exercise caution, after eight Hong Kong tourists were killed in a bus hijacking in Manila. "The consular section of the foreign ministry and the embassy in the Philippines warn Chinese citizens to be cautious when travelling to the Philippines," the ministry said in a statement. "Chinese citizens in the Philippines must pay attention to security risks, step up measures of self-protection and immediately inform the Chinese embassy of any emergency situations." A disgruntled sacked policeman commandeered the bus carrying 25 Hong Kong tourists on Monday in a desperate bid to win his job back. The ordeal ended when police fired tear gas into the bus and a sniper shot the hostage-taker. China has strongly condemned the hijacking and urged the Philippine government to ensure the safety of Chinese travellers. |
| "To secure peace is to prepare for war." - Carl Von Clausewitz | |
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| al'Lan Mandragoran | Aug 24 2010, 07:09 PM Post #70 |
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![]() Bang Lu Min is not on the list of of tourist manifest on board that bus. |
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"In wars, boy, fools kill other fools for foolish causes." "Run when you have to, fight when you must, rest when you can." - Robert Jordan; The Wheel of Time | |
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8:49 AM Jul 11