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China Open to Joint Oil Development
Topic Started: Jan 8 2013, 02:13 AM (3,828 Views)
Marschall
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Why a joint-venture with China and not the US or Russia - or even the EU? Would we want Communist China to remain a strong regional force? No, we do not. They are not to be trusted and the areas where the explorations are meant to take place are our territory: thus, there is absolutely no need for us to do this cooperation with them. Better do it with our actual allies - old and/or new.
We need to be more independent from China - economically as well.
"THE BEST PARENT AND GUARDIAN OF LIBERTY AMONGST MEN IS TRUTH" ~ Pope Leo XIII, Immortale Dei

“When learned men begin to use their reason, then I generally discover that they haven’t got any.” - G. K. Chesterton

MSantor is not a man of sound reason. Savages have always preferred the club for they know that they are powerless against the pen. But who is the greater fool - the savage or the one that gives him power? May Truth rebuke you.
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wily_pest
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whatever venture u have with the commie they should as mentioned above, (1) recognize all spratleys and scarb shoal phil. ownership and dismantle all structures and remove all their ships, (2) do not use chinese rigs (perhaps rent american or european ones) bec once they put their rigs they will just tell the phil. to just leave (a ruse to get their rigs set up), (3) the cut should not be 50/50 bec the oil belongs to the phil, and their only contribution is just expertise and, (4) something in line with 10/90 with the 90% for the phil.
Management of many is the same as management of few. It is a matter of organization. Sun Tzu
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Santi Kampilan
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wily_pest
Jan 8 2013, 12:42 PM
whatever venture u have with the commie they should as mentioned above, (1) recognize all spratleys and scarb shoal phil. ownership and dismantle all structures and remove all their ships, (2) do not use chinese rigs (perhaps rent american or european ones) bec once they put their rigs they will just tell the phil. to just leave (a ruse to get their rigs set up), (3) the cut should not be 50/50 bec the oil belongs to the phil, and their only contribution is just expertise and, (4) something in line with 10/90 with the 90% for the phil.
The only problem with China recognizing our 200 mile EEZ is it literally debunks its claim on the Spratly's and Scarborough Shoal. Also it invalidates 9 dash line. They will never do that. They've elevated Nansha as if it is one of its provinces.

By doing a JV without relinquishing sovereignty, you're just giving them "a lick of the sugar stick" to keep them at bay and buying us enough time to rearm and modernize. As it is now we have nothing to show forth and if we say no they may create havoc and there is nothing we can do about it.

The Malampaya, our flagship project, is owned by Shell 45%, Chevron 45%, and PNOC-a gov't owned corp is 10% just to give you an idea. I don't know how much Energy Forum will relinquish if CNOOC will come in the picture. I just hope that the basketball feud (Trillanes vs. MVP) will not spillover again on this potential stalemate breakthrough.
Edited by Santi Kampilan, Jan 8 2013, 02:23 PM.
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raider1011


“I think they (Forum Energy) are now discussing a joint cooperation with China. It’s a very positive sign. Why not let two companies discuss the cooperation? I think cooperation will be the best way,” Ma said.

The language is already deceptive. CNOOC is state-owned, a front for Beijing. It's word is worth nothing without Beijing's say so. They're trying to make it look like an independent actor but it's not. If it does something objectionable they can go "oh look the Philippines is bullying a private company." It is a party to the same issues the ambassador is trying to make everyone conveniently forget. Meanwhile the status quo remains. No real concessions on their part.
Edited by raider1011, Jan 8 2013, 02:31 PM.
God grant me the courage not to give up what I think is right even though I think it is hopeless.

|| Chester W. Nimitz

Loyalty to the Nation ALL the time, loyalty to the Government when it deserves it.

|| Mark Twain
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Santi Kampilan
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raider1011
Jan 8 2013, 02:27 PM
“I think they (Forum Energy) are now discussing a joint cooperation with China. It’s a very positive sign. Why not let two companies discuss the cooperation? I think cooperation will be the best way,” Ma said.

The language is already deceptive. CNOOC is state-owned, a front for Beijing. It's word is worth nothing without Beijing's say so. They're trying to make it look like an independent actor but it's not. It is a party to the same issues the ambassador is trying to make everyone conveniently forget. Meanwhile the status quo remains. No real concessions on their part.
It will be their loss definitely. Not ours. Those will always be in our backyard. I think Pnoy said it well, " They can Joint Venture for as long as it is under the Philippine laws". Which means we are not giving an inch.
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raider1011


^That's only to our advantage if they respect ours and international law in the first place. The danger is if they're just looking for an excuse to say "okay we tried to be reasonable so . . ." If they're that desperate for resources then what's stopping them from acting when they feel they're ready?

Ultimately this is our fault.
God grant me the courage not to give up what I think is right even though I think it is hopeless.

|| Chester W. Nimitz

Loyalty to the Nation ALL the time, loyalty to the Government when it deserves it.

|| Mark Twain
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ganymede09
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After the successive harassment at sea and endless namecalling on official media, they say this - PROC version of the classic good cop/ bad cop. Watch out, PH govt must not succumb to the pressure from the kings of doubletalk.
LET'S RAISE OUR MIDDLE FINGERs TO THE MIDDLE KINGDOM.
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shoot_to_kill
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hell no, i'd rather us be patient. we must be the one to develop it with another partner who isn't interested in our territory.

why? cause they're already in control of the west Philippine sea whether we like it or not and once problems arise in the so called partnership it will always be in favor of the chinks since it would be their rig and manned by the chinks we can never even know if they're gonna really give us the real 50 percent or their so called meaning of 50 percent(whatever that is)

we can wait they cannot, if they try to use force they know they will be at the losing end of it, even russia might speak up if they use military force against us and worst case scenario it would not like the old times where they use tactics wherein the super powers are busy fighting each other(psychologically that is) and then they move in for a sneak attack, cause were talking about oil here and the americans already got a first glimpse of chink harassment in the west Philippine sea
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Santi Kampilan
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raider1011
Jan 8 2013, 02:48 PM
^That's only to our advantage if they respect ours and international law in the first place. The danger is if they're just looking for an excuse to say "okay we tried to be reasonable so . . ." If they're that desperate for resources then what's stopping them from acting when they feel they're ready?

Ultimately this is our fault.
Well, true. No one can stop them. But the US can. But they are waiting for us to make a big mistake and use that as an excuse also (like PH sending a gray ship to scarborough) to accomplish their goal. But what was smart was for us to turn to uncle Sam right away. I think they are really afraid if they push it hard, Uncle Sam can easily make excuses such as relocating 4,000 marines to be displaced from Okinawa to Palawan or give us outright 48 F-16's and 6 Perry's or just even placing the big eye, the x-band radar in Wallace Air Station. The US is also waiting for them to screw up to give Uncle Sam a valid reason to reposition its assets.

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PinoyAko
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PNOY already said, we must stick to it, " what ours is ours", means the 200 EEZ. Disputed is different story. We can deal it with other countries but not with them. :fire: We should not bite their bait. :thumbsdown: Always remember, 99.9% of of their words are the opposite of their actions. :nono:
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