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Retitled: China's "De facto" Control of Panatag Shoal/Bajo De Masinloc; Old Title: China ropes off Scarborough Shoal
Topic Started: Aug 10 2012, 07:38 PM (25,229 Views)
Parastriker
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Batusai
Jun 7 2013, 09:08 PM
Quote:
 
Haven't you learned the value of patience? If we act now, then we will lose! Don't you grasp the logic of the current situation? If we act like brave and valiant idiots then we have thrown away people for nothing! At least, when we get UNCLOS in favor to us, then we can act, regardless of Chinese opposition!


Well...we did not act...we did not became brave and valiant idiots...but we still lose didn't we?

Do you seriously believe we have already lost? :dunno:

And anyways, if you had read this statement;

Quote:
 
Seeing that the Chinese are very irrational and two-sided when it comes to making decisions, this might just be a valid observation on their part


I am sure that you will understand what was implied. And don't bother to ask for evidence in my suggestion; you have seen it many times, yes?
Success through information, victory through disinformation.

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gammy322
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By the time the UNCLOS resolution/decision comes out, we can never get SCS as it is already fortified. When does the DND/AFP wakes up to this miserable mess they got into....
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Parastriker
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gammy322
Jun 7 2013, 09:14 PM
By the time the UNCLOS resolution/decision comes out, we can never get SCS as it is already fortified. When does the DND/AFP wakes up to this miserable mess they got into....
Gosh, the people here seem to be defeatists nowadays.

Why do you suppose that when we get UNCLOS, (and therefore major support from U.S. and other allies and possibly NATO as well) we couldn't destroy something as cheaply built as an island fortification?
Success through information, victory through disinformation.

"Good leaders make efficient followers. Great leaders make good followers. But true leaders make leaders out of mere followers."

"Measuring the intelligence of a common internet user is as easy as looking at his/her grammar."
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Analyst
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Parastriker
Jun 7 2013, 09:21 PM
gammy322
Jun 7 2013, 09:14 PM
By the time the UNCLOS resolution/decision comes out, we can never get SCS as it is already fortified. When does the DND/AFP wakes up to this miserable mess they got into....
Gosh, the people here seem to be defeatists nowadays.

Why do you suppose that when we get UNCLOS, (and therefore major support from U.S. and other allies and possibly NATO as well) we couldn't destroy something as cheaply built as an island fortification?
The whole UNCLOS case thing is a very long process...it takes years to make a decision. By then the Chinese would have overrun Pag-asa already.
And our administration hasn't whined about the loss of Panatag Shoal.

P.S. With all due respect sir, I think their posts are rather a product of depressive reality rather than defeatism.
If you don't want a modern and capable AFP, you might want to get the f*ck off the Philippines because you don't deserve to be a Filipino that's why!
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Parastriker
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Jun 7 2013, 09:38 PM
Parastriker
Jun 7 2013, 09:21 PM

Quoting limited to 2 levels deep
The whole UNCLOS case thing is a very long process...it takes years to make a decision. By then the Chinese would have overrun Pag-asa already.
And our administration hasn't whined about the loss of Panatag Shoal.

P.S. With all due respect sir, I think their posts are rather a product of depressive reality rather than defeatism.
Oh, I'm sorry for the use of the wrong word.

UNCLOS could be resolved within 2-3 years if we fast-track everything. Unless we miraculously obtain the capabilities necessary to fight the PLAN in more or less even terms (qualitatively or otherwise), we will stick to our UNCLOS song-and-dance.

At last, that is what I envision we are doing and will do in the future, unless something untoward is being planned by USN and PN.
Success through information, victory through disinformation.

"Good leaders make efficient followers. Great leaders make good followers. But true leaders make leaders out of mere followers."

"Measuring the intelligence of a common internet user is as easy as looking at his/her grammar."
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mikegalvez
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When WPS is already fortified with Chinese structures and surface ships, even if we win our case in UNCLOS - who will enforce the Law/the ruling...No One....will America commit its forces of driving them away or pressure China to just leave and dismantle their structures? The world maybe watching but who among them has the courage to act for our sake. They will support us thats for sure but in what kind - moral support?

Sad to say but were on our own, unless we take urgent steps of developing our defenses along with every diplomatic solutions on sight just to buy time for the training of our men and purchase of needed hardware.

Just my opinion though, I may not be able to please everyone but its the truth.
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gammy322
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Parastriker
Jun 7 2013, 09:21 PM
gammy322
Jun 7 2013, 09:14 PM
By the time the UNCLOS resolution/decision comes out, we can never get SCS as it is already fortified. When does the DND/AFP wakes up to this miserable mess they got into....
Gosh, the people here seem to be defeatists nowadays.

Why do you suppose that when we get UNCLOS, (and therefore major support from U.S. and other allies and possibly NATO as well) we couldn't destroy something as cheaply built as an island fortification?
Defeatists??? I dont think so Sir Para. Just Frustrated and depressed!!! :headbang:

Where is Capt. Faeldon by the way.... :salute:
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Parastriker
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mikegalvez
Jun 7 2013, 09:54 PM
When WPS is already fortified with Chinese structures and surface ships, even if we win our case in UNCLOS - who will enforce the Law/the ruling...No One....will America commit its forces of driving them away or pressure China to just leave and dismantle their structures? The world maybe watching but who among them has the courage to act for our sake. They will support us thats for sure but in what kind - moral support?

Sad to say but were on our own, unless we take urgent steps of developing our defenses along with every diplomatic solutions on sight just to buy time for the training of our men and purchase of needed hardware.

Just my opinion though, I may not be able to please everyone but its the truth.
"but its the truth"

That is pretty harsh, but considering the fact that is is speculative on your part does not make it the truth, I think.

War is full of imponderables that you could only know once you have already pass through those. I mean it as both positive and negative, but I am quite sure that every claimant country against China is looking for ways to humiliate the Red Menace. And basing on historical means, I think that U.S. has a debt of honor to us, from our support in WWII up to their usage of bases in the Vietnam war. I think more or less that makes "The U.S. Question" everyone has been asking tilt in favor to us.

But I do think we are straying far off-topic, wouldn't you agree?
Success through information, victory through disinformation.

"Good leaders make efficient followers. Great leaders make good followers. But true leaders make leaders out of mere followers."

"Measuring the intelligence of a common internet user is as easy as looking at his/her grammar."
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Parastriker
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gammy322
Jun 7 2013, 10:01 PM
Parastriker
Jun 7 2013, 09:21 PM

Quoting limited to 2 levels deep
Defeatists??? I dont think so Sir Para. Just Frustrated and depressed!!! :headbang:

Where is Capt. Faeldon by the way.... :salute:
That is of course, understandable. All men falter on one way or another.

I couldn't answer your question because I honestly don't know. I'm an analyst, not a stalker.
Success through information, victory through disinformation.

"Good leaders make efficient followers. Great leaders make good followers. But true leaders make leaders out of mere followers."

"Measuring the intelligence of a common internet user is as easy as looking at his/her grammar."
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Batusai
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Parastriker
Jun 7 2013, 09:12 PM
Batusai
Jun 7 2013, 09:08 PM

Quoting limited to 2 levels deep
Do you seriously believe we have already lost? :dunno:

And anyways, if you had read this statement;

Quote:
 
Seeing that the Chinese are very irrational and two-sided when it comes to making decisions, this might just be a valid observation on their part


I am sure that you will understand what was implied. And don't bother to ask for evidence in my suggestion; you have seen it many times, yes?
Did we already lose? When was the last time that a PCG or PN ship was seen in that particular area? Can our fisherman go on with their lives without fearing that a chinese vessel might come and drive them away? Now, they are in the process of putting up a structure...did we already lose?
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